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Weekly Debate #7: Parenting
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Post by
DuckDuckGoose
Sounds a little extreme! Actually, it sounds very extreme! A cattle herding impedment shouldn't be used on children! It couldn't be good! Slightly less invasive is your use of exclaimation points! Not that they are bad! I had just never seen so many! Thanks for your insight though!
you love to pick at people, don't you? you are so ready to say "you are wrong". It is like you are looking for something wrong so you can point it out. I went back and read over this thread and from what I can tell, you would make a horrible parent. I don't think your kids have very much respect for you.
Post by
MyTie
Hello Duck. May I call you that, or do you prefer Mr.Goose?
You're right that I don't mind pointing out when people are wrong. I won't argue that with you. As far as my parenting style, would you mind citing a few things I have said that tee you off to my 'horrible' parenting?
Thanks, and welcome to randomness!
Post by
240135
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
DuckDuckGoose
As far as my parenting style, would you mind citing a few things I have said that tee you off to my 'horrible' parenting?This thread really should be about "How to display common sense when raising kids". Slapping/beating isn't common sense. Tea/crumpets in place of punishment isn't common sense.common sense, like you use it here, means whatever you think it means. what you are saying is that you are right. you should not raise your kids however you think 'common sense' tells you to, which is all in your head, but instead should try reading a few books on parenting. maybe a child psychology book. maybe go to a seminar. you shouldn't think that you are right all the time. i bet you treat your kids just like you treat everyone here. dirt.
Post by
MyTie
common sense, like you use it here, means whatever you think it means. what you are saying is that you are right. you should not raise your kids however you think 'common sense' tells you to, which is all in your head, but instead should try reading a few books on parenting. maybe a child psychology book. maybe go to a seminar. you shouldn't think that you are right all the time. i bet you treat your kids just like you treat everyone here. dirt.
Good points! I think you are right, about a lot, but not all. I have taken classes on psychology of human development, as well as read a number of articles and books on child development.
As far as me thinking I am right all the time.... well... I really don't. I don't know how else to argue that. I have made mistakes while parenting, I know that very well. Usually my wife is able to point out my mistakes to me. Sometimes parenting is a learning experience for both of us... well change 'sometimes' to 'usually'.
Parenting is hard... very hard, and very rewarding. I try to treat my kids fairly, with respect, and with discipline. I discipline them and myself so as to set an example for them. My house may be a challenge to live in, but a challenge in a good way. I make my kids think and ask questions. Also, my house is very consistent. My kids know what to expect, and that they can rely on me. Although, they know that I am flawed. I have never hidden that from them.
Our opinions will differ on what good 'parenting' is. If you would like to just blinding shoot in the dark at me, fine, but I would prefer you brought up specific examples. Thanks.
Post by
montezuma7
Hmmm... agreed. However, 2-3 year olds should not have to be reasoned with through spanking. Through positive reinforcments you should be able to 'train' a kid that young. I would say punishments shouldn't exist in that case... I could be wrong, but I wouldn't think spanking a 3 year old would be effective. Verbal and physical positive reinforcement. Beleive it or not, the same methods used to train dogs work on children that young. I'd never spank a dog. They wouldn't get it. Neither would a 3 year old. By the time they are 5, they are so keen on communication, a simple look in thier direction can fix a bad behavior.
Except that some of the best methods for training dogs include swatting them, "nipping" them with your thumb, index and middle finger together in their neck, kneeing them hard in the stomach in the case of a jumping dog who is large enough to handle it etc. Also you don't treat dogs as equals deserving of your respect, you are supposed to establish dominance. Dogs are pack animals, very different from children. The only real similarity is that both need discipline and structure to thrive, but you don't really give respect back to your dog like you're suggesting with a child.
Post by
Random0098
I think it's a bad idea. Not only because harming a child is crap, but also because it teaches them that it's alright to do it.
That's from page 1... Still relevant, right?
Post by
montezuma7
I think MyTie is pretty much right in this department though with his structure of discipline. You start out easy, dicuss things, move up to more drastic measurements if necessary. I think a swat on the butt is ok as one of those more drastic measurements, but if it doesn't sit well with you then don't do it. There's plenty of other consequences and ways to show a child that actions have consequences. I was spanked as a child and remember the spankings never really being that bad- the bad part was having to go in front of my dad, he would say do you know why I'm doing this? and I'd have to explain yeah I screwed up and did whatever and that was more shameful and embarassing than the actual hurt of a spanking. And I only got spanked til I was like 8 anyway, it's not that scary after that.
My fiancee on the other hand never got spanked and doesn't want to spank our kids when we have kids and I'm cool with that too. It really comes down to how you want to do it imo (although anything more than a swat on the butt or hand is abuse).
Post by
MyTie
but you don't really give respect back to your dog like you're suggesting with a child.Can't say I agree with that. Depends on your defintion of 'respect' i suppose. They aren't equals, I'll give you that.
Post by
315080
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
montezuma7
but you don't really give respect back to your dog like you're suggesting with a child.Can't say I agree with that. Depends on your defintion of 'respect' i suppose. They aren't equals, I'll give you that.
Like you don't really care how a dog feels about something, you just want him to obey you. Beyond understand how a dog feels/acts/thinks so that you can manipulate him to obey you, you really shouldn't give a crap about his "feelings," plus dogs don't have feelings like humans do. A child you're going to sit down with and have a dicussion and figure out where they're coming from so you can possibly come up with a solution together.
Post by
MyTie
Like you don't really care how a dog feels about something, you just want him to obey you. Beyond understand how a dog feels/acts/thinks so that you can manipulate him to obey you, you really shouldn't give a crap about his "feelings," plus dogs don't have feelings like humans do. A child you're going to sit down with and have a dicussion and figure out where they're coming from so you can possibly come up with a solution together.
Dogs do have feelings. They experince fear, anxiety, happiness, excitement, depression, etc... The same types of chemicals that control your brain during different actions also pulse through their brains during the appropriate circumstances.
I will agree that you sit down and have a discussion with a child, though. Of course, dogs can't communicate through speech. Both entities have emotion, though. I already states on an earlier page the importance of communication with a child.
Anyway, your arguement is that dogs don't have feelings. I would disagree. If you would like to argue against me still, I would ask you to provide scientific evidence to back up your claim.
Post by
172996
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
MyTie
Communication is key. My wife and I sit down and discuss situations that might come up in the future. We decide what we think is an acceptible response to hypothetical problems. For the most part, we agree. Sometimes, things come up when only one of us is around. That person may do something that the other doesn't agree with. The absent person, at that point, usually understands that the other person did what they thought was best, and the situation can now be talked about between both of us. You have to place a large amount of trust in the other person. You are, after all, leaving your children alone with that person. A lot of the major 'controversial' issues my wife and I discussed before we even got married, to make sure we were on the same page.
We also discussed 'irresolvable scenerios'. In the event that we don't agree, and we will not compromise our views, and we will not allow the other person's views to override our opinion, we find ourselves at one of these 'irresolvable scenerios'. In the event we have one of those, she agreed, before we got married, that she would do as I decided. This places a lot of responsiblity on me to know when and where to 'play that card'. I would only do it in the most desperate situations. This form of 'force' is not prefered to a healthy agreed relationship. Sometimes, my wife makes a decision that I know will lead to a mistake. I disagree with her decision, and ask her to reconsider. Sometimes, when she decides to stick with her opinion, and I know she is wrong, I still would rather let her make that mistake, instead of forceing her to do what I think is right, since she is not mine to control. It all comes down to trust, respect, and self discipline. The steps to making a decision go something like this.
1) Propose problem.
2) Discuss problem.
3) Resolve problem. (if not, move to next step)
4) Compare and contrast differing opinions and examine the benefits and costs of both. (if not resolved, move down).
5) Propose a compromise between views. If no compromise agreed on, move to next step.
6) One person voluntarily gives in to other person's decision.
7) Discuss ignoring the problem, or delaying the resolution. Perhaps more time is needed.
8) Look outside ourselves for the answer. Sometimes a book has the answer, or a friend.
9) Inspect compromise options one last time.
10) Offer chance to voluntarily 'give in'.
11) In the case that there is nothing else has worked: She does what I say.
We have only seen step 11 once or twice the entire time we have been married. It is not a pleasant place for either of us.
Post by
L33tsauce
Like you don't really care how a dog feels about something, you just want him to obey you. Beyond understand how a dog feels/acts/thinks so that you can manipulate him to obey you, you really shouldn't give a crap about his "feelings," plus dogs don't have feelings like humans do. A child you're going to sit down with and have a dicussion and figure out where they're coming from so you can possibly come up with a solution together.
Boy, you most be one spectacular pet owner.
(Off topic, I know.)
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