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Warlock 3.1 Tanking Guide
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Post by
467179
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
ok. first, the spell hit table does not work like the melee one. a roll is done for hit and miss then a second roll is done for crit. this means that a low hit chance actually reduces your crit chance below your character sheet percentage. if 17% of your spells miss that 17% that never got a chance to be crits. if you have a 50% crit rate you'll be critting on half of the remaining 83%. this is, of course, 41.5%, a big difference from your 50% character sheet crit.
second, the searing pain glyph increases crit
damage
not chance. 1 glyph is not going to be twice as powerful than 3 talent points is it?
in this (as you say half serious) hypothetical scenario, hit matters. more than ever.
while searing pain is fine for single targets, every spell will receive the maximum pushback of 1 second making our quick nuke a slow one. we have no high threat AoE spells and for that will be reliant on meta+IA. the only way we would have a chance of maintaining threat would be to have large amounts of spellpower and as much hit as possible.
Post by
467179
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
"warlock tanking " is dependant on far too many talents in demonology to hit shadowfury. what's more SF isn't nearly as useful as you're thinking it is since a lot of the difficult things to tank will be immune to the stun. as for AoE threat, i don't necessarily top the threat meter among other DPS when i'm in my best DPS gear and DPS spec. how do you think a warlock in pvp gear and tank trinkets is going to hold threat in AoE without meta... even with meta.
i've said before in this thread but the fun hypothetical really runs into a brick wall on the threat problem.
Post by
Infleto
how did this start up again. . .
Really tanking as a lock if fun. trying to do it is a PUG will never happen as people will not go for it. it took 4 hours to get group for H Nexus. The healer was my Boy friend and one DPS was my BF's Dad. 4 hours to find 2 DPS.
So you should be theorycrafting on a way to get a group going first.
Post by
asakawa
lol.
it's an interesting concept to flex your theorycrafting muscles on. interesting because it's such a cross-over thing, combining details of pvp, tanking and casting. good stuff.
Post by
467179
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
oh i didn't mean that as a slight on you or anything, just a silly expression.
Post by
snackwell
I'll still tank better......
Mana Shield Spam HOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Snacks Dah Mage
Post by
asakawa
as interesting as it was erudite. many thanks.
Post by
thehuntard
Ok so i accidentally just clicked on a popup that took me away from this page and deleted the massive post i had been working on...so ill try to sum it up.
HP: I went through and added buffs and included stam trinkets and talents and most 226 pvp gear and came up with about 44k hp with all pertinant buffs.
DR: I saw that a lock in that gear would have 2241 armor from cloth, 600 armor from agi, 2730 from demon skin, and 1800 from either a pally or shaman making about 7400 AC giving 31% DR
69%*94% from molten skin, * 90% from master demonologist, * 75% from soul link/glyped gives a total dmg taken as 43%. My dk has about 37% and is in toc 10 mans.
Warlocks have "Demon Skin" which increaes, with talents, healing recieved by 26%.
If a tank has say 30% dodge and 20% parry and mitigates 63% of the dmg he recieves. Then he effectively gets hit (70%*80%), 56% then he takes 63% away from that giving he needs to be healed for 21% of the dmg the boss is doing...
So lets say that a healer does the same amount of heals toward a warlock. We take 43% of the dmg that the boss is doing...that is TWICE the dmg the other tank will take! If you factor in our 26% healing bonus we need to be healed for 34% of the dmg the boss is doing. so...for us to be as effective vs physical dmg as a tank with the above stats, our portion of healing has to be 13% of the dps the boss is causing, 1225/.13= 9400dps.
In short, a lock tank doing drain tanking could be as effective as a toc10/25 geared DK if the boss wasnt doing more than around 10k dps. That isnt an ANUB boss but thats a POSSIBILITY for tanking.
--If you chose to go the side of affliction up to siphon life ive got us pegged at just about 2900-3k raid buffed SP. and maybe 1.15 haste. SO...if we do a drain tanking look on it...
Siphon Life gives us (1080+1.56*2950)*1.13*1.1*40%/18sec=157hps with demon skin its about 200 hps...now for the fun one
(133+ 14.3%*2950)*1.13(CoE)*1.18(Imp DS)*1.1(haste)*1.26(Dem Skin +hp)=1025
For a more Threat based spec, you should go down the dest tree only halfway since anything past Soul Leach would not be usefull for tanking. And even Soul Leach is not response to TPS questions...
Threat for a lock tank will be based on two things spellpower and crit chance
-spell power- i added up base spell power from a full set of 226 pvp gear and got about 2200 including no gems/enchants/buffs. Assuming pretty good buffs/chants/gems im sure it could reach around 2900-3000.
-crit chance:Imp Searing Pain, 10%; Glyph, 20%; Base from int/crit, 20-25%; Demonic Tactics, 10%; Shadow Bolt, 5%; Backlash, 3%; Devastation; 5%; and lets say for Shiggles you can get a boomkin in there...5%. Bringing your crit chance to a purdy 83%
Base dmg of spell: (375 + .43*2950) *1.13(CoE)*1.15(Ember)=1643 dmg
Including crit chance: ans * (1-crit+2*crit)=3000avg hits
including threat x2: 6000 avg threat, or about 4010 threat per second. So a dps would have to be doing 4010*1.1or1.3 for melee and ranged respectively so the only way for people to pull aggro off a lock tank with this going on...is to be doing over 4.5k dps with NO aggro wipes or reduction talents. That is very unlikely assuming your group has any clue wtf is going on. A DK tank doing 2000dps would put up barely over this amount of threat in frost presence and 2k is very very good for a tank so i would say that threat is not a problem.
All that said...i wanna try it and i need to sleep!
Post by
asakawa
again, many many issues with maths and general misconceptions about DR.
aff has no threat - it can not tank.
HIT is too important to ignore.
the SPain glyph does NOT give 20% crit chance (see above, we did this already).
also... i'm no pvper so i may be missing something here but i couldn't find a 226 arena set on wowhead. i'm assuming you made a wowhead profile so perhaps you could link it?
Post by
WoWTheoryCraft
also... i'm no pvper so i may be missing something here but i couldn't find a 226 arena set on wowhead. i'm assuming you made a wowhead profile so perhaps you could link it?
There isn't.
PvP gear progression is:
Hateful (200) -> Deadly (213) -> Furious (232) -> Relentless (251)
Post by
asakawa
good to know. seems to somewhat undermine a lot of thehuntard's comments.
Post by
239567
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Silarey
Lulz, warlock win.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RS-mk2WMq8I
We already tank. This is all old news!
Post by
asakawa
you derisively say "old news" then link a youtube video of a warlock tanking a ToC boss when in the original post there's a video a warlock tanking patchwerk. this is much older news than you seem to think.
Post by
Chills
how did this start up again. . .I'm surprised there are very little mentions of
Keleseth
in here. Probably because it's an easy fight? :D
Post by
asakawa
...or because this is an old thread and that's a brand new encounter?
Post by
104412
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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