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Touch of Chaos better than soul fire ?

Post by Beimbah

earlier today with 488 ilvl reforged to mastery (even mostly gemmed (for affliction)) i tryed to test out the damage output of ToC vs. SF. this is min/maxing and would probably only change the execute phase of demonology if i am correct.

i tested with same buffs etc over and over again, and ended up with 150k SF crits and 130k ToC crits(65k hits), meaning the damage pr. execute ofc is higher on SF, but since SF costs 80 Dfury and ToC only 40, i had to run some numbers and i ended up with this: theoretically you have (1000/80) SF casts if entering meta with full fury (just forget doom and corruption ToC refresh for a sec) and 1000/40 ToC casts meaning twice as many, but since ToC is not a 100% crit ofc soul fire is better ? or is it !

on MY toon with current stats, this mean that if i have have 15% crit my ToC will hit for 75k on average while soulfire will always only hit the 150k making the damage equal?and so every crit % above 15 is more worth it for ToC ?

i realise that SF damage scales with crit but i doubt it will provide more damage than a single ToC crit, also another thing to notice is the standard decay of Dfury, for every second you have Meta enabled Dfury will decay wich makes casting SF decay more Dfury pr. cast than a the instant ToC probably resulting in maybe 2-3 more ToC's and 1-2 less SF's, this is all theory so i need some feedback ? am i missing something ? imo SF is gimping itself by always being a crit.

Post by ganimede

DPE(dmg per execute) isn't quite as important as DPET(dmg per execute time) since SF (with MC of course) has a 2sec cast time and ToC is instant (so just a GCD 1.5) you can divide the average dmg numbers by their relative cast times and see something like this assming 0 haste and MC SF has a 2 sec cast and ToC is a GCD so 1.5, and using your 15 % crit, you'll have to use your haste number to adjust their relative cast times for the arithmetic to work out exactly right for you but i don't think it'll have much of an effect on the outcome.

150k/2 (75k) < (130k*.15+ 65k*.85)/1.5 (49.8k) so when considering time as your limiting factor (as dps is) it's better to use SF. The general formula you can use with your tested numbers is...
AVG dmg per execution / Cast time OR

(SFdmg/SF cast time) vs (ToC crit dmg * crit% + ToC hit dmg * (1-crit%))/GCDadjust the GCD for haste

so in this instance, in terms of dps, SF is better for you to cast. I'm not certain how these numbers will change for you as your stats change but you will definately want to re-assess this as your gear gets better.

Thats the raw DPS answer above, you are right to consider the Dmg per Fury as well as other things are going on while you are in meta, saving fury for other, harder abilities like Chaos Wave and Immolation aura has a more significant impact on your DPS, using more Fury for SFs may not net you more overall DPS. But this question is much more complicated

I treat the whole situation it like this

If you're in a burn phase, use SF while in meta. It's the clear choice
If you're target is close to death and you risk having fury leftover, use SF while in meta.
If you're target has a long time to die, use ToC while in meta rather than SF, save the MC procs for re-building Fury quickly after you leave meta.

hope this helps solve your delima.

Post by Chewb

I use ToC as soon as I get into Meta, to refresh corruption, then Doom, then if I have MC procs ill SF. I enter meta around 800 fury and leave at 450, then build back up and repeat. Back the the SF Toc thing, if the boss is about to do a phase where they go away(like last boss HoF) ill spam Toc just to get fast damage. Otherwise ill SF only with MC procs ofc.

Touch of Chaos better than soul fire ?

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