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10.2.5
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Question about talent Master of Elements.
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Post by
Godwolf
I can't believe that you can't imagine a way in which Improved Blink is not a crutch, but a direct DPS increase if used intelligently.
Let baddies stay bad, let them "theorycraft" on their own.
I would do that if he seemed like an idiot. But he seems smart and just... Not getting this to click.
Post by
783051
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Zakkhar
She has nether vortex and no imp Ae. I repeat = Big progression doesnt mean you play your class optimally.
Why do we need arcane explosion zak?
Maybe not to use Blizzard that costs 10 times more mana, hits half as much (at zero ab stacks), does 5 times more threat and cant be used while moving...
My breakdown on our first kill on Rag (just now):
AB 7.44M 69.9%
AE 1.44M 13.6%
Missiles 800k 7.5%
Barrage 350k 3.3%
Post by
greywolfsage
It only has to buy you a couple of ABs to completely slaughter Fire power in terms of overall damage.
It only has to BUY you a couple AB's... that is to say if you mess up or get way out of position it will help the dps loss. Simply don't screw up.
It buys you AB casts because you are where you need to be sooner than without it...
2% of his damage is from Flame Orb. Little over 2 mil. Getting 2% more on that is
44k damage
. Add in hypothetical detonation from talent, and its 60-70k damage. Total. Added.
I dont know whether you ever played fire but you are mistaken. Flame orb damage doesnt have anything to do with Fire power. Even as fire is quite neglectable - the talent itself is only good due to percentage modification to whole fire dps, explosion is load of crap (bonus). Fire power is listed as fire power, not as flame orb. Your best mage in the server doesnt seem to have the crap talent you are so eagerly advocating.
4 lowest damage on Alysrazor parse (i am in fire):
Mirror image frostbolt 0.3%
Volcanic destruction 0.2%
Fire power 0.1%
Mirror image fireblast 0.1%
And its always like that. Hell even crap 2p t12 gives me more dps.
PS: Your best mage on the server uses Blizzard. His spec is &*!@ (Nether Vortex lol), so are his glyphs (Slow, Mirror Image, lmao) plus he lacks running speed on boots and is under hit cap. High progress doesnt make you a good theorycrafter - when will people understand that?
Said "one of the best guilds", not "best mage"
The Log was from Arcane spec, not Fire, really not sure where you got that from. Half the discussion here is taking Fire Power as Arcane to boost Flame Orb's dps.
The point of my anecdotal evidence was the effect of Fire Power's 2 point investment over an entire night's log from a 25 man Heroic run, as that's where you'll see the players that aim for the most damage and likely to have the best gear and likely to have every buff in the book so as to provide every ounce of effect to spells to be analyzed.
Post by
151788
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Zakkhar
I also (as a 10 man raider) will ALWAYS take 2/2 Nether Vortex....I get stuck dealing with adds more often then most (Beth/Shann/Ryo) and not having TTW up even for 2-3 ABs would be a dps loss of way more then any talent I would take other then NV.
Whats your raid setup? Because i usually raid with Boomkin (shrooms), Hunter (traps), Frost DK (any dk that uses frost fever would do), enhance shaman (earth shock), shadow priest (mind flay) and warlock (that one doesnt have anything proccing ttw).
Even on a boss fight I wonder how ofter the tanks slow drops off of the boss...
I hope never, they hardly need to worry about aggro now.
In a perfect world the tank would Thunder Clap or w/e before it drops but sometimes that Shield Slam or Revenge may get priority over the Thunder Clap and boom 2-3 ABs w/o TTW...
On farm bosses maybe, if any tank prioritises dps over survival on progress he wont progress far.
Flame Orb is not very much dps for the Arcane Mage...adding 2% to spell contributing to 1% of your overall damage is not going to ammount to much of a dps increase.
The Log was from Arcane spec, not Fire, really not sure where you got that from. Half the discussion here is taking Fire Power as Arcane to boost Flame Orb's dps.
How many times i need to write this?
Fire power explosion damage is doesnt corelate with flame orb damage the slightest. Fire power damage is listed as
Fire Power
and is not any certain part of flame orb damage and usually ends up below DMC: Volcano. Its not 1%, its 0.1%. 2% of flame orb (and fireblast) damage and 0.1% from explosion is hardly worth 2 talent points.
Post by
151788
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Zakkhar
Matter of personal preference i guess, if i see a point of applying slow i can just use this one gcd and apply it (manually), improved blink adds something new to existing ability so i prefer it.
Post by
greywolfsage
Holy Shammy
What is this spec you speak of? XP
The Log was from Arcane spec, not Fire, really not sure where you got that from. Half the discussion here is taking Fire Power as Arcane to boost Flame Orb's dps.
How many times i need to write this?
Fire power explosion damage is doesnt corelate with flame orb damage the slightest. Fire power damage is listed as
Fire Power
and is not any certain part of flame orb damage and usually ends up below DMC: Volcano. Its not 1%, its 0.1%. 2% of flame orb (and fireblast) damage and 0.1% from explosion is hardly worth 2 talent points.
You're saying a lot of things that are getting horribly tangled.
Fire Power would boost fire spell damage by 2%, seeing as it's Flame Orb (
hint, its a fire spell
, it would get 2% more damage.
Fire Power adds a detonation to Flame Orb, which
does
correlate to
Flame Orb
because it's the
source spell
Are you trying to say Recount/Skada track it as a separate damage statistic? Because that's different.
You went off into being Fire spec for some reason, when we've been on the discussion of dipping 7 points into Fire for Fire Power to boost Flame Orb's damage dealt as Arcane since Flame Orb is a favorite tool to spam Arcane Missile Procs as part of Conserve Phase.
I honestly have no clue where you're train of thought took you.
Post by
783051
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Godwolf
YOU STILL DON'T GET THIS!
Read this. Read this well.
To be within range of something, you have to RUN there. If you get Imp. Blink, you don't have to run to 20 yards away, you have to run 30 yards away and blink a split second earlier, then use the increased run speed to cover the rest of the distance.
AKA YOU SPEND LESS OVERALL TIME RUNNING AND MORE TIME CASTING.
And to top off you still not understanding this, read this:
http://www.wowhead.com/spell=1953#comments
Post by
Zakkhar
Blink moves a player 25 yards in any direction. Now I'll be honest if you are more than 25 yards away from something you need to hit, which now puts you OVER 65 yards away from this target you need to improve your game.
Yes, because blinking sideways is totally non-existant (rag).
Almost no boss mechanic in FL makes this occur for an arcane mage.
Out or my head Ragnaros, Shannox.
The only situation right now would be spiderlings on beth'tilac for current content and possibly rag.
Funny how you said almost no boss and than mentioned two bosses one being final boss of the content.
But arcane mage's shouldn't probably be on spiderlings unless your raid comp stinks, and in rag I'll challenge you to be more raid aware, though it is a very big learning curve.
Its not about composition, its about priorities. Mage (mine) priorities are Spinners > Drone >= Spiderlings. Its not about who is on what, its about completing the encounter. If someone doesnt do spinners will you just stand there and do nothing waiting for the boss to eat them?
I can blink without improved and be there in range, ergo negating run speed. What does extra run speed do if you are already in range? Nothing at all. Point being: be in range its not that hard.
You can blink in range and run back while AE with the improved boost speed, so you can faster be on the spot where you need to be when Beth goes down.
On Shannox (hc, because normal is such a big deal) there will be a lot of kiting and chances are the Dog will run out of your range - the run speed bonus may be life or death for a person being faceraged atm.
On Rag getting out of seeds and getting on the spot earlier lets you start nuking before everytone else, getting away from meteor lets you nuke without needing to worry about it for some time. Not to mention certain times where you just blinked into engulfing fire and you have to move away asap.
Flame orb is a fire spell. The move does 2% more damage because of talent: Fire Power. And it has a 66% chance of exploding for 2817.
It sure is, but look how you just it has been calculated:
2% of his damage is from Flame Orb. Little over 2 mil. Getting 2% more on that is 44k damage. Add in hypothetical detonation from talent, and its 60-70k damage. Total. Added.
Detonation does
way
less damage, is what i am trying to say. I play fire, i got logs detonation is %^&*.
Post by
Zakkhar
The Log was from Arcane spec, not Fire, really not sure where you got that from. Half the discussion here is taking Fire Power as Arcane to boost Flame Orb's dps.
How many times i need to write this?
Fire power explosion damage is doesnt corelate with flame orb damage the slightest. Fire power damage is listed as
Fire Power
and is not any certain part of flame orb damage and usually ends up below DMC: Volcano. Its not 1%, its 0.1%.
2% of flame orb (and fireblast) damage
and 0.1% from explosion is hardly worth 2 talent points.
You're saying a lot of things that are getting horribly tangled.
Fire Power would boost fire spell damage by 2%, seeing as it's Flame Orb (
hint, its a fire spell
, it would get 2% more damage.
Fire Power adds a detonation to Flame Orb, which
does
correlate to
Flame Orb
because it's the
source spell
Hint hit read my post carefully.
I bolded the part you completely ignored trying to be smartass (i guess its an epidemy).
Post by
303016
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Zakkhar
Pretty hard to carefully read and comprehend the posts of someone who writes like this...
Fire power explosion damage is doesnt corelate...
Can you point out to us a single sentence within the structure of the English language where the connection of these words makes a scent of sense, Zakkhar?
Until then, cram your trap and quit telling people to improve their reading comprehension while you continue to string nonsensical sentences together.
Its pretty simple, look at the tooltip:
Fire power is a name of a talent. It consists of increased fire damage and an explosion, hence the usage of fire power explosion (damage) usage. Remove the is. It was an obvious typo from a previous sentence and it has perfect sense.*
* - noticing this requires functioning brain. Troll harder, brah.
Post by
Nathanyal
Pretty hard to carefully read and comprehend the posts of someone who writes like this...
Fire power explosion damage is doesnt corelate...
Can you point out to us a single sentence within the structure of the English language where the connection of these words makes a scent of sense, Zakkhar?
Until then, cram your trap and quit telling people to improve their reading comprehension while you continue to string nonsensical sentences together.
You found one sentence like that. Care to point out another sentence that is like that? Because it seems that everything Zakk has typed is a bunch of nonsensical crap according to you.
To me I understood it all.
Post by
303016
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
greywolfsage
2% of his damage is from Flame Orb. Little over 2 mil. Getting 2% more on that is 44k damage. Add in hypothetical detonation from talent, and its 60-70k damage. Total. Added.
Detonation does
way
less damage, is what i am trying to say. I play fire, i got logs detonation is %^&*.
That's what I said...
44K damage dealt from boosted tics of flame orb, extra.
This total extra damage becomes ~70k when accounting for the detonation.
Post by
Nathanyal
The point I'm making is that Zakkhar is consistently critical of people putting forward arguments, citing poor comprehension of his own (as a counter-point). His posts are often rude, arrogant and rife with poor spelling and grammatical skills. For him to call on others to absorb his crux when he cannot practice as he preaches is laughable and this thread is a perfect example of where the constant childish bickering is leading no-one to an agreeable conclusion.
Yet here you are to point out his obvious typo in one sentence throughout this entire topic. As for the spelling and grammatical errors, this is not grade school and you are not his teacher to judge his spelling and grammar.
The only thing you done was criticize him about his spelling and grammar and not posted something that is remotely on topic like he has since the topic was started. If your only intent was to chastise someone about how they treat others, then you should have a look in the mirror.
If you can't handle rude and arrogant people over the internet, then you can't make it in the real world. Unless you hide away from everyone then you will encounter at least one rude or arrogant person, more if you work in retail.
The reason no one agrees is that there isn't a real clear cut decision. Some don't think the slight run increase after blink is useful while others think that a 2% increase to one spells is much better then having a better Arcane Explosion. Nether Vortex isn't the best unless you're attacking something on your own and no one else can apply a slow, which you can easily do with only 1 GCD.
Post by
303016
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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