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Live
PTR
10.2.5
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10.2.6
31-point talent tree N:th version.
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Post by
Aadramelekh
Oh dear. You do realize this line of reasoning is completely invalid.
Yeah, sorry, that was meant to be implied in my "that assumes nothing else changes" sentence but I suppose I ought to have been clearer.
Largely, my post was meant to be a "Napkin math shows it's not all that different, but really we can't even know yet how things are going to play out so you might as well wait and see." But I guess the second half of that sentence wasn't really in there as much as I thought it was.
No ^_^ Your post was a direct reply to
Yunaleia
's message, which said "currently with 40% ish of all damage done while in kitteh form is auto attacks anyway ". Even more, your napkin math was also based on
Yunaleia
's numbers, thus referring to the current state of things.
As such, the napkin math
is
invalid, because
a lot
of things will change in a substantial manner. Thus the damage distribution from different types of attacks will be very different than what we have now.
Post by
oberondreaming
As such, the napkin math
is
invalid, because
a lot
of things will change in a substantial manner.
Right. That's sort of what I was assuming people would know.
But you're right, I shouldn't assume people know things on the internet. ;)
Post by
Yunaleia
Currently with 40% ish of all damage done while in kitteh form is auto attacks anyway, you reduce "special" attack damage by a bit and increase auto attack so the two might balance out over all.
I've never once been in a raid or dungeon and and had my melee even come close to 40% of my over-all damage... Where did you get that number from? If your melee is making up 40% of your damage, then your doing something terribly wrong. At most, melee will make up 20%-30% over-all damage, and ranks # 2, 3, or 4. So going with 25%, add 20% to that (5%), and your melee dps is now 30% of your over-all damage. K, now lets subtract 30% from the other 75% of our over all dps (22.5%), and you get 52.5%... So lets see here.... How is an over-all net loss of 17.5% (-22.5% loss + 5% = -17.5%) good, or roughly the same?
Actually, from the sounds of it, you're doing something terribly wrong.
You wouldnt happen to be an ArP kitteh whose forgone every other stat and just piled on the ArP left right and centre, with next to bugger all hit and expertise, and losing out on a huge portion of DPS that stems directly from ... oh yea! white attacks! So no, my number (napkin) isnt wrong at all. So stop being bad and take what I say as gospel in your profound case. If you have the time you can read back through some old posts where
Failkor
, sorry
falkor
, had this same problem of understanding that an attack that misses isnt fine and just because your 100% ArP capped doesnt mean that a 13k shred is okay to miss ... HERP DERP ...
With respects to
Aadra
thats probably the reason behind it. Although ... thinking about it, would this be the end of 100% uptime on Rip, Rake, given that they will tick out far faster than you can pile on CPs again?
Post by
oberondreaming
Although ... thinking about it, would this be the end of 100% uptime on Rip, Rake, given that they will tick out far faster than you can pile on CPs again?
If you're talking about haste affecting DoTs, it doesn't work like that (in Cataclysm). Haste gives you faster ticks on DoTs and HoTs, but it doesn't affect the duration. So with enough haste, you're going to get extra ticks per application. But you'll have the same amount of time between necessary applications.
Also, clipping HoTs and DoTs won't reset the tick timer, just extend the duration. The way Everlasting Affliction or Pain and Suffering works now.
Post by
129046
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Aadramelekh
Haste gives you faster ticks on DoTs and HoTs, but it doesn't affect the duration
You might want to check that out for logical fallacies. Faster ticks
will
mean lower overall duration of those DoT effects. Only when reaching certain breakpoints (there's a detailed topic around here from some time ago where this matter was discussed in detail) will extra ticks be added and the duration extended back up to its original value.
Right. That's sort of what I was assuming people would know.Assumption is the mother of all f*ckups they say ^_^ And it didn't seem like you were assuming anything anyway. Your math was applied on the current state of things. While the point was a change that will be implemented in Cataclysm (along with many other important changes). That is why the "40% * 1.5 + 60% = 120% versus 100% * 1.3 = 130%" napkin math is invalid.
Sorry for nitpicking like an as
s
hat :D I haven't been around here for a while and I like stirring up people. Not as much as
foley
, but I'm trying my best...
Post by
oberondreaming
You might want to check that out for logical fallacies. Faster ticks
will
mean lower overall duration of those DoT effects. Only when reaching certain breakpoints (there's a detailed topic around here from some time ago where this matter was discussed in detail) will extra ticks be added and the duration extended back up to its original value.
For DoTs and HoTs, the actual duration of the effect doesn't change. You'll have some 'dead time' at the end where the effect is still up, but there isn't another tick coming. (Is this what you're referring to?) But with the new tick-loss-less clipping that isn't really lost time, since you can refresh the duration at any time and get another tick right where it should have been.
They were talking about doing something kind of like you're describing for channeled effects (Rain of Fire, Hurricane, etc.). Where haste reduces the duration until you hit a break point then adds another tick. But I don't think that's what's happening for HoTs and DoTs.
Post by
615276
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
LookOut
Today's blue post on MMO added something small for the next beta talent build (at least I hope it'll be included in the next one):
Furor
We have actually swapped Furor (now in Feral) and Heart of the Wild (now in Resto).
Source, in case anyone cares for such a small note :p
Post by
oberondreaming
Furor
We have actually swapped Furor (now in Feral) and Heart of the Wild (now in Resto).
Source, in case anyone cares for such a small note :p
I think this a reference to Furor picking up the 6% intellect. It would be kind of obnoxious to Restos at this point if they switch the two current talents since Furor now does something for Restos and HotW doesn't.
Post by
129046
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
oberondreaming
Furor did just get more interesting.
This
is the updated tree. I now am not entirely sure what to do with a resto build - the number of desirable options for pve now seems to exceed the number of points I have to spend. A delicious quandary, to be sure.
I'm probably gonna skip master shapeshifter. 4 talent points for 4% extra healing doesn't seem like it matches up with other options.
Thus something like
this
.
Post by
SignupSucks
Mana is mana is mana.
Not quite. Remember buffing intellect doesn't just affect mana, spellpower is also derived from intellect. With 3000 intellect (ballpark, given inflation, for where intellect will be geared at 85), 6% intellect would grant an additional 180 intellect - 1800* mana and 180 spellpower. Conversely, 15% mana would be just the 4500 mana.
*I'm assuming that with the conversion of spellpower into intellect causing intellect to increase, the amount of mana gained by a point of intellect will be reduced from the current 15:1 to 10:1.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
oberondreaming
Mana is mana is mana.
Not quite. Remember buffing intellect doesn't just affect mana, spellpower is also derived from intellect.
I think Nnoutaja was mostly taking issue with my statement that HotW "does nothing" for Restos, by pointing out that it would actually do something (that is, give mana).
Which I suppose is true, but it's significantly inferior to the current implementation of Furor as you've shown.
Post by
129046
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
oberondreaming
Thank you for not failing
I try. ;)
Post by
129046
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
492259
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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