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Why Bring a Warrior Tank, when you can have: DK, Pala ?
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Post by
256309
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Zakkhar
So the question is : why bring a warrior tank when you can have : DK, Pala or Druid ?
Class doesnt make the tank. Player is.
Have one fury or arms warr who does the sunder and dm shout happy day's, he can be fear immune to break a spell cast from a boss, thats it. no need for another warrior in the raid.
Its deffinatelly your point of view. And its probably shared with Blizzard. No need specifically for Pally, Druid or DK either. Any tank will do.
I have tanked for a long time now from classic wow and I'm just now sick of the warrior tank how down hill it feels really next to a equally geared : DK or Pala and maybe a Druid.
I think you should open the window and get some fresh air. This virtual game deffinately has too big influence on your emotions.
I have a Dr00d tank where I did tank all of the classic stuff to Naxx25 and also a warrior who has done the same both have good gear and are in a guild who is with the better ones of the casual guilds on my server.
And where is the point of this statement?
I will put a question mark on the druid as I did park that one a few months ago and all the druid tanks have been inactive for many months now, so I do hear that they are rather good atm as MT and OT.
From what i heard and what i noticed, all Feral tanks switched to dps.
For Hard encounters where the guild is pushing or in fact falling behind as its summer time and we need to recruit new players,who are less geared and have a slower reaction time so less healing for the tanks, with that situation in mind the other tanks are much more forgiving and will make the encounter smoother for the casual guild doing 3 raids a week, turning a wipe fest into a success.
It totally depends how you spec, gear and glyph the warr. If its for progress tanking customise it for progress tanking.
I have about 43k hp in raids(with flask) with most Ulduar tanking bits 20% parry 20% dodge 29% block 26k armor, just basic tanking stats as an OT in Ulduar for a casual guild.
And exact point of you quoting your full buffed stats is?
What I'm getting sick of :
Calm down, get some fresh air, find a girlfriend etc.. There is much to much emotions for a virtual game which is supposed to be fun. If its not fun for you - dont play.
* Rotation: is getting old with and out dated with the new tanking style. AoE and CD's
Erm, you still use rotation?
* AoE: tanking is a joke next to the other ones, other tanks can set down a big area template on the ground before mobs even will spawn, and get some serious aggro on them all on command.
DKs can put it anywhere in 20y range for the cost of putting half of their runes on cd and it lasts 10s.
Pallies can put it around themselves, it lasts 8(10 if glyphed) seconds, and they can reaply it once its finished. But thats exactly all they got if it comes for AoE threat (warrior has much more multi skills he can use)
Druids - i dont think ferals have such skill.
Its sure good, but its about style. Warriors have other abilities. You think its harder? Reroll DK.
* Rage: has for a long time lost its awesomeness for a tank as other classes did go OOM back in the day examle: a Pala tank never goes OOM thease day's, it is better to have an ability on command and ready.
Rage is great. Doesnt suit you? Reroll paladin. And yes they do go oom in certain situations.
* Mobility: we can charge back and forth who give's a @#$% , when you cant AoE tank smooth for the casual dps in in an aoe fight, dps will some times turn into Zombies and they will dps every thing and save the skull for last as you did mark, pulling aggro and get one popped, its a fact and will never change in casual guilds.
I didint understand a thing after the first sentence. "Open the window, get some fresh air..."
Have troubles with aoe tanking? Learn it. Or reroll paladin who can go afk when tanking.
*Raid boss tanking: all classes can do this just fine, but Id rather have a DK MT as
he can chain CD's to get the job done
, they have more armor and more HP :
not even talking about the CD's.
Hmm, you arent mentioning CDs yet you mentioned them as major factor before. I am confused.
Warriors have CD's as well. More more powerfull than DKs. You can chain them as well, just same as DK tank you need to spec/glyph into them.
*Nerfing: So they might nerf the DK class a bit next patch, as it is Over Powered no doubt about it.
Nerfing the DK will not sovle our problems it will just hurt the casual guild more.
Its sure overpowered. Does it mean all people should stop playing their mains and reroll DKs?
Bolded part: How it will hurt casual guilds? It may hurt bad players, that i agree.
Few ideas:for 3.2: a new extra CD with a 1 min cd and a few sec duration, where you take 20% less damage, so you can pop that in mid fight and not have to blow shield wall as healers are slow to react on taunt switch for example.New AoE ability that will replace the vigilance talent, (vigi will be free) call it Warrior Musk : and aura of rage and dirty armpits surrounds the warrior aggravating every thing surrounding the warrior in a smelly haze of rage and funk.
Post that in Blizz forums. I am sure they will take you serious. But before you post it.. "open a window and get some fresh air..."
Feel Free to comment this rant of mine it will have error I'm sure, please refrain from replying having nothing constructive to say and if you did reach this far kudos to you good sir.
What does kudos mean?
Post by
Kramp
Good luck finding a dps warrior who wants to screw up his dps rotation for DS and sunders.
Post by
256309
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Anarchy
Yeah thanks for disecting his post and disagreeing with everything to make yourself seem superiour and more intelligent, for all you know he could have a girlfriend and be outside "getting fresh" a lot.
That's got nothing to do with anything, we all play this game we all want to be competetive and right now death knights are clearly superior.
Think you'd be &*!@ed off if your favorite class which you've spent a lot of time on is deemed the worst at its role.
Post by
Anarchy
Good luck finding a dps warrior who wants to screw up his dps rotation for DS and sunders.
True, but it is damn easy, when I was raiding on my warrior I'd be the one stacking sunders, the warrior tank didn't seem to care about them and just stacked them casually and would often let the 5 stacks fall off.
Never see any DPS warriors sundering either, they all think it's only usable in defensive stance.
There's definitely time between abilities to keep both up without affecting your personal DPS.
Post by
DaCyclops
Oh Please. Sure, they have some more AoE skills. But we have our own ways. We have silences, a pack of stuns, two high-agro AoE's, target debufs, frequent taunts and more.
In my group there are two tanks. Me and a Pally. The Pally was there first, and gets the "MT" tag. In trash pulls, normally I will pull a mob off him and tank it solo. Thats pretty much as far as the "MT" tag goes. We tank bosses based on what we are good at.
Grand Widow in Naxx, I charge in, grab all the adds, and he taunts the boss off. I grab the adds because I have the on-trigger AoE, not the ticking one.
Maexxna in Naxx - I tank the spider while he lays down his AoE and tries to grab all the little spiders.
Kologarn in Ulduar - He "tanks" the main body, while I "tank" the arm and the adds that result. Because adds can escape his AoE before it can tick significantly.
Iron Council - He tanks Steelbreaker at first, because he can decurse himself quickly. I take the other two, because I can either silence/stun the caster, or Shield Slam away the rune guy's shield.
Hodir - I tank Hodir for the most part with Vigilance on him. If I loose agro and he taunts, I taunt right back after he is hit once. I have a couple of cooldowns to blow to resist as much of Frozen Blows as I can.
Sure, he has a AoE he can lay-down and grab agro with. He has his own heals. He has decurse abilities. He has his bubble. And that's what sets him aside.
I have a set of stuns and silences, including an AoE stun. I have Vigilance for taking threat from someone. I have Shield Wall and Last Stand for large dammage moments. And I hold single-target agro like no-one's business. That's what sets me aside.
.
Why would you bring a Warrior Tank when you can have a DK, Pally or Druid?
Because they get the job done... Their Way.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
" Class doesnt make the tank. Player is " this looks good on paper but in practice I feel you might not know what your talking about tbh.
Actually in my experience it's true. I consider myself a good tank (warrior) so I tried tanking with my pally and did just as well. Now I have a DK and still doing just as wellas with my warrior and pally. 3 very different play styles, but they all use the same principles which I have more or less mastered.
Post by
Rushlow
What the original reply was trying to say in the sense of "Class doesn't make the tank, the player does" is that you could play any tanking class and learn to be just as great as any other tanking class based on the ways that you personally play your tanking toon as a class. Basically,being a Paladin or Death Knight tank may have it's advantages over a Warrior tank, but it all comes down to how well a person plays the class in the first place. A person could be completely dense and know absolutely nothing about tanking, playing a paladin tank, and when they fail, they'll go off and say "Paladin tanks are too weak! Buff me!"
I'll admit that there are some prominent things wrong with our class from a tanking perspective, such as other classes having a seemingly easier time with AoE threat and maybe some rage starvation issues, but I do have to agree that it does depend largely on the player behind the keyboard on how well a tank performs in an instance, warrior or not.
At least Blizz has been thinking about adding extra rage generation to when we dodge, parry, and block. That would obviously help our rage starvation issues, and with more rage around to use passively, we are able to throw out more yellow damage, therefore more threat.
Post by
Cloud8690
Class doesnt make the tank. Player is.
This will only take you so far. Good tanks will definitely shine over bad tanks. But, at least from what I've experienced, a good dk will still out-perform a good warrior tank of equal skill and experience when it comes to general raid boss tanking.
Post by
masti
Why?
Becus the ppl that havent abandoned their main class for some other in paper better tanking class are usually more committed and do the job properly.
Post by
Neoguy327
I can't imagine a warrior tank who doesn't actually use devastate.. I mean that helps proc your shield slams which is a warriors highest threat ability. Besides They are buffing warriors major in 3.2. Double block value on everything except shields? Helll yes! That means shield slam will hit harder you will take less damage and damage shield will hit harder as well. Warriors are the premier tanking class, and its the job that they've always done well.
Post by
78077
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Zakkhar
"Class doesn't make the tank. The player does."
Utter bull.
Consider this - if I pick up a Paladin or a DK right now, and tank, I'd do it better than I could on my Warrior within an hour of playing. Why? Because the class itself is simply superior.
Class isnt superior in general. Its superior to you, which either means you arent as good warr tank as you think you are or Pala/DK fits your playstyle better.
Like them better? Think you will be able to do everything your warrior does AND something more, reroll. Just dont cry after.
I'd like to add another cliche;
"You can only work with the tools you're given."
In response for your cliche. Dont talk about tools others have, when you havent mastered yours yet.
Everyhing seems to be better when you arent experiencing it.
I tanked as warrior, dk and a little bit as pala. Its very different style of tanking. Each has own advantages, some classes have more of them, some less - its just a matter of playstyle how you use them or whether you use them at all.
Post by
Porcell
My only problem with warrior tanking right now is lack of instant ranged threat and rage being dependent on getting hit (which can occasionally lead to threat issues when you get avoidance streaks).
Trash can be frustrating, but I try and look at it as a team effort rather than a competition. I grab my one or two targets and tank them fine.
The fact remains that I can and do MT any fight in the game. The only, ONLY fight I am not well suited to tanking is Yogg-Saron because of the aforementioned ranged threat issue, in which Paladins are much better at. When mobs have to be in melee range, and you need to be getting hit to cause threat, that can sometimes cause problems.
One of the big benefits of a warrior MT is that TC, Demo, and Sunders are all on the boss without bothering off-classes to do it.
The buff to block value is only part of the way there. They've said they have other things in store for fixing block, and I'll be very interested in seeing what that turns out to be. At this point I've gotten rid of all of my block rating gear, and only have a 2 more pieces of block value gear to switch out of my main tanking set.
Post by
256309
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
306782
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Porcell
Spell reflect, silences Shield wall, 60% LESS damage. Last stand.
^
Many effective Oh sh*t buttons
I love my 4 piece Tier 8 bonus when tanking Mimiron....
Post by
161859
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
DaCyclops
Iron Council - He tanks Steelbreaker at first, because he can decurse himself quickly. I take the other two, because I can either silence/stun the caster, or Shield Slam away the rune guy's shield.
You tank the Runemaster and Stormcaller together while the other guy tanks Steelbreaker? I've never tried that, but thought it would be difficult when you have to run from Overloads.
You would think so, but really those two in the first phase are almost an insult. Its more a chalenge to dance Stormcaller out of the runes (silence and back away, just to reduce raid damage) and keep Runemaster from realising he has a babysitter (thunderclap/shockwave/cleave agro). Stormbreaker doesnt even target you constantly, and Runemaster doesnt hit all that hard before the second phase.
Generally if I run sidewards to Runemaster (or at worst, do some hopping-blocking) when Overload is cast he still seems to whack my shield. Then I just charge back to Stormcaller and keep interupting his puny lightning. When Steely goes down, I just stop AoE tanking for a bit, while the other tank grabs Runemaster. And we go round again....
Really tempted to ask the group rogue to help me, so we can get the "Cant do this while stunned" achievement - I can only manage to stop 2 in 3 attacks at the moment :D
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