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All-In-One Warrior Guide (NEW: 3.1.0 Analysis Added)
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Post by
78077
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Post by
Piz420
gracias mex
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Post by
lonewarrior
Ok..looking over your fury tree...couple things I would like to debate and theorize with you.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=LG0f0fhZGxz0E0ubeRVzAo
Your first line has 2 points in booming voice(an AOE)..which to a DPS warrior seems a waste. it only adds one minute and Its just a duration effect..any DPS having a fight lasting more then 2 minutes is in the wrong line of business. Now you can argue that it saves on rage points because you don't have to re-spam during instant runs..but I'm of the the opinion that if your going to DPS then every point should improve my DPS damage.
Second line
you have no points. Now the zero points in Unbridled Wrath makes sense once you have Titans Grip. Even though its based on melee damage..weapon speed still plays a factor..Even with flurry..if your using the proper weapons then your speed will still only be hovering around the 3sec mark..with that in mind.saving the points for the arms tree..you could pick Anger Management which guarantees a rage point every 3sec instead of just a chance of it and only cost one point. But there is one possible exception here and that is the bleeding caused by Deep Wound/Rend. It is considered physical damage. If physical damage caused by every bleeding tick is considered melee damage then in theory..every tick can generate a rage point with Unbridled Wrath. If someone could or has tested this out by using Rend and then stopping all attacks and watching their combat log to see if any rage points are generate by Unbridled Wrath then we might have and answer to that. If this information is already known and I'm in the blind..forgive me.
Third line
..the Improved Cleave seems a wasted point. A DPS is going to be getting crit...3 points in Blood Craze seems a must.. at 6% at level 80 your averaging above 1200+ health buff. No reason not to take..its like a free health potion without the CD. Command shout is fine.
Fourth line
is fine..except for no points in Enrage..now they are not the most efficient points spent for a buff, but since damage is always being taken, its bound to proc once and the boost is always welcomed.
Line 5,6,7
looks fines except the three points in Intensify Rage. You have to ask yourself..is the amount of time the knock off the CD really worth it..? Except in the BG's, where else are you need of to pop any of these more then once during their normal cool down. Now if your a BG's freak by all means take it..otherwise save the points.
Everything else is fine except for the 3 points in Bloodsurge and hear is my reason why. First off..the typical spam rotation already consist of Bloodthirst, Whirlwind and Slam.Should instant Slam pop up..most likely you already have one of the other attacks ready to spam anyway. Some people may argue that its like having an extra attack buff since its instant,but the fact is,since it only procs on a
Bloodthirst
critical hit and since Bloodthirst is 1/3 of your spam rotation in actuality it still comes down to a 33% chance that you ever get to use Bloodsurge. I would rather put my points in Enrage and be able to get a buff on all my attacks for the next 12 seconds.
Here is a fury tree I have set up.take a look and see what you think.
http://www.wowhead.com/?talent=Li0hzfhZhxbciVubxRqzVo
P.S. Whoever wants to argue against what I wrote..all I have to say is...you maybe right. :)
Post by
78077
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Post by
lonewarrior
Now, onto Bloodsurge. Firstly, your maths is wrong. It's 100% chance of an instant Slam when you crit when you have full points into it. This is a Fury Warriors "Sword and Board" equivalent. It's a key part of your rotation. Not having it is simply insanity. And if it wasn't insane before, check out the new patch notes - Bloodsurge will proc off a Heroic Strike and Whirlwind critical hit as well as Bloodthirst - meaning you'll be using Slam all the time.
Starting from the bottom..I didn't say a 33% proc chance..I said that since Bloodthirst is one of at least three attack spams in your rotation..that if it doesn't proc(because you didn't score a critical hit) that you would have to wait for the cool down and cycle through your other attacks before getting back to Bloodthirst.Rotation=Bloodthirst/SS/Slam=33% usage for each attack. So what I'm trying say is..would you rather have a chance proc(Enrage) that can proc on any attack or one that Proc on just one(Bloodthirst) and needs to be critcal strike to boot. Just my thought. The new patch of course nullifies that and the fact that they are changing it, convinces me that Blizzard saw it as weak.
ntensify Rage is DEFINITELY worth the points. The DPS boost to having a 2 minute cooldown on Death Wish and a 3 minute cooldown on Recklessness is massive - especially on long boss fights. You are severely gimping yourself not picking that up.
After watching videos of some heroic and Naxx boss fights..I have to agree..it does become very useful. My view of it was more generic. It's just a degree of where your at in your level 80 phase. A person just hitting level 80 and still doing reg mode can use those point in other places until he needs to re-spec.
The Bloodcraze selection was a place to put points. If all you do is raids and no arena then of course its worthless. Wintergrasp would seem the perfect spot to have it though.
With your Unbridled Wrath point, again you're theorising that rage = DPS no matter what the talent or scenario. This simply isn't true. Unbridled Wrath is currently all but a pointless talent. With Titan's Grip, it's entirely pointless. The fact you mention Rend is worrying - you shouldn't be using Rend at all as a Fury Warrior. The extra one point of rage in any scenario is not worth the wasted points, especially as you're aiming for a flat 51 points in the Fury tree.
The Rend was thrown in there just to cover the bleeding part..you don't have to worry I've been at this a long time..I know Rend should never be a part of any normal rotation. Deep Wound was the main part of my point.I was just theorizing whether its physical bleed damage would fall under damage done by a weapon stipulation of Unbridled Wrath..if it did it might do damage high enough to trigger an Unbridled Wrath rage point. Also..something I just learned..Unbridled Wrath is normalized for weapon speed..so its not a total waste for titans grip. Weapon speed plays no part of its proc and I would rather put points there the in booming voice.
In regards to Booming Voice, you and I will just have to agree to disagree.
a.) there is a glyph that increases Battle shout by one minute and the Dps should spam it prior to a fight..should he need to spam it again in a 5 man raid he doesn't need the increased AOE..if he is in a 10 man or 25 man..the other tank or dps warrior will spam it for their group.
b.) The command shout is done by the tank prior to a fight..when he should tell everyone to gather next to him as I do. After that..it may need to be spammed only once and only necessary for the Tanks benefit if the fight is going well.
C.) Any DPS who spams Demoralizing shout is just not doing his job..that's a tanks spam. Also increasing the range could be dangerous if its spammed while a Patrol happens to walk by while your fighting..and cause a total wipe.
This is purely a tank talent and why its in the first line of the furry tree is beyond me.
Well those are my counterpoints and clarification of my previous comments.
That's what makes WoW so interesting ..the different approaches people can use to succeed at the same goal. Peace !
Post by
GimlerNL
Hi there,
I have a question regarding your leveling specc. You went to arms before picking up Dual Wield Specialization and Precision, does that mean It's best to level with a Two-hander untill I've got those talents or should I just pick up two one-handers?
It's an alt so picking up a weapon or two at the AH isn't really a problem.
Thanks in advance.
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78077
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Post by
lonewarrior
Let me ask a question, are you taking this in from PERSONAL experience from a raid? or heroics?
Is this an objective review through WWS and dps meters done by various different fury warriors in COMPETITIVE (well, naxx aint close, but you get the point) 25 man raiding?
Do you have any numbers to back this up?
And last but not least, are you trying to say that the accept spec by almost all high-end fury warriors in this 11 million-people-playing-game is an inferior evaluation to yours?
Not to be flaming dude, but some of what you said have the most senseless arguements.
Accepted specs...?
OH..so there is one cookie cutter spec for DPS and that's it. Fine.show me what it is...so I can tell Blizz to eliminate all the other choices..no one is ever going to use them.
The trouble with any attempt to classify..what is best ..is that it always dependent on gear and intent....is someone DPS/arena ..DPS/BG....DPS/raid..etc.
My point was to do away with all that and concentrate purely on one constant.."DPS".
To use every point available to increase pure damage.
Anything else is an argument of apples and oranges.
Which is ok..I'm not saying Tubey's post was in error..I was just offering a different view. Tubey likes booming voice for its use in raids...I think its a waste, because it's points used, that do nothing to increase DPS. Just comes down to preference.
As for my understanding of this..I m a level 80 warrior tank doing Heroics now. I have specced in all trees over a dozen times..just to test out numbers on many occasion.
I do actual in game testing to see what's going down..not just accepting hearsay.
I am a GM with many melee type level 80's dps under me. I think I have some experience in what to expect from a dps. How many people actual read the combat log after each boss fight to see what the melee's were hitting/missing/or being parried and which abilities were doing the most damage. I think I have some credentials.
As for presenting numbers..nothing I said had anything to do with numbers..but selections in our fury tree. What are you reading..? The only numbers I used was percentages..Bloodthirst has a cooldown..usually by the third spam its back up..you want to use it again 1out 3 ..33% are those numbers confusing to you.
Mexloh..you didn't offer anything to this post you just went blah.blah.blah...and then called me dude. Don't call me dude...DUDE! ..oh by the way, I'm not flaming you .
P.S. Tubey..my post wasn't to discredit your excellent thread. Just wanted to see where you were coming from and offer up my perspective. I'll keep to the sideline from here out
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302823
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78077
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302823
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Post by
lonewarrior
In fact, you brought this upon yourself through your condescending reply to lonewarrior.
Ouch ! ..is that what he did to me..? Funny I didn't feel a thing. :)
Seriously though, Erfinda...your points are well taken..but you we're a little hostile or at least it seemed that way.
Unless it's asked for..there is no such thing as constructive criticism..it's always taken as an affront..human nature I guess. I try to avoid that and instead engage in debate with my replies... unless I'm provoked.(a few post up)
The last thing a threads needs is a "that's you..but what am I ?" breakdown.
There are no absolutes in this game..except one..and that is either you live or die after each battle and that's the bottom line isn't it? If you succeed..your tree is fine. Everything else is a varying degree of acceptance.
So...make peace..and lets get this thread back on track.
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