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Why They're Called Welfare Epics
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Post by
142785
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Post by
Merik
if you had to spend time and work for something, its not welfare.
if you got something for free, then its welfare.
last i checked,
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=31986
requires 27000 honor and 40 AV marks.
last i checked,
http://www.wowhead.com/?item=28504
requires 10 people (or less) and 1 boss kill in karazhan
they both take time and effort, the only difference is you know when you'll get one of the above bows, and you have to depend on luck for the other. last i checked, this does not define 'welfare'.
go to
www.dictionary.com
and type in the word 'welfare'
either come up with a better word or drop this welfare argument completely.
So it's a problem with the term being used or the fact it's just plain easy to get pvp epics.
Post by
Avallen
I'm really not sure why "welfare epics" is a negative term.
It's a
good
thing that players that are jumping into endgame late aren't excluded from experiencing all the game has to offer.
I think a majority of the tension that seems to envelop this thread is the jealousy factor - when really, there's nothing to be jealous about. PvP is open to all players. There's no reason to be upset that a hunter in S2 out DPS'd you when you could easily go grab it yourself!
Worry about yourself, and how much time and effort you want to put into getting gear and making your character better, and you'll be a lot less frustrated (and envious) down the road.
Post by
172885
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Post by
92896
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Post by
TriniKrusader
I'm really not sure why "welfare epics" is a negative term.
I think a majority of the tension that seems to envelop this thread is the jealousy factor - when really, there's nothing to be jealous about. PvP is open to all players. There's no reason to be upset that a hunter in S2 out DPS'd you when you could easily go grab it yourself!
Majority? It looked to me like the people who were most angry were people who passed that level of content already. That isn't jealousy, that's bitterness because of perceived injustice - sort of "why did I have to work so hard for this if other people get it so easily just because they joined the game later?"
It's the same reaction people have had to mounts at 30, the same reaction there was when the honour system changed before, the same reaction when levelling got easier.
And to the person who said crafting was easy, roll a blacksmith. I spent the better part of a year and well over a thousand gold steadily working toward a two hander that's equivalent in DPS to weapons now attainable through marks. Epic fail.
Post by
GenXCub
And BC made all the time we spent in Molten Core to get T1 gear worthless too. This is a game that should hopefully teach you not to get too attached to your gear.
Post by
Syphris
They're called welfare epics, not because of "elitists" branding people who don't raid or do heroics as worthless human scum, but because they ARE. The reasoning is that they're waaay too much something for nothing, as there are almost zero repair costs out of BGs (not counting the one or two points of damage from weapons) and there's no need to really pay attention!
In raiding or even normal dungeons, the repair costs are harsh, mainly when you start out, and you'll find yourself needing to pay attention, mainly on bosses like Netherspite and Shade of Aran. It's not because PvE needs more skill, or that PvP does, (although it could be argued Arena is the raiding of PvE, considering that you need specific specs/class builds with certain gear, kind of destroying the point of it) it's because PvP COSTS NOTHING.
That is all.
I lose 10-15% durability from 3-4 hours of BG.
Each NPC in AV (and only AV) give 6-10 silver sure but it gets split with everyone near you so expect 2-3 copper per mob.
A good PvPer does play the battlegrounds and does pay attention, which results in more kills, more wins, and more honor.
PvP takes more skill than PvE in many situations though they are balanced. PvE is the same fight with the same trash and bosses every week. There is no random aspect. You try fighting another player and finding an ounce of repetition. I've tanked, healed, and DPS'd raids up into BT and truth be told it isn't all that hard for anyone. Sure you have to move around or switch targets or even click something but you are doing all that at once constantly in PvP.
Tanks pretty much spam the same few abilities and occasionally move to a new target or drag the current one. Healers do little other than click from one of the 40 bars on their screen to the other and rarely do anything other than potion, hit heals, and move around.
DPS is the worst case. Mages spam fireball until OOM, druids spam their highest DPS spell, etc, etc (most classes also have something secondary to re-apply i.e. slice and dice, scorch, swarm, totems.
So it is really a toss up of what you consider skill latency and constant movement make pvp exciting, while PvE has a sense of accomplishment to it when you down a boss for the first time and takes some brain power and leadership to do successfully. Battlegrounds are a bit of a cluster **** right now but hopefully we will see some improvements.
On a side note: GTFO our forums with your q.q spam. Go to the official WoW forums if you like chatter of OP classes and welfare epics.
Post by
98207
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135116
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174028
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30936
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Post by
mojojojo101
I don't have anything against arena players tbh so dont pull that card on me.
However i do not think that it is fair that a player who has juts dinged 70 can get merciless armour/weapons(which in some cases are equal or better to some T5 quality items) after just 10 -12 hours where as if they followed the pve route it would take MONTHS to get to this kind of gear level.
You make the point that it would take the average player approx 9hrs to grind enough honour for a piece of merciless gear and that this is approximately the same time it would take to run kara 3 times. However what you forget is to run kara 3 times takes 3 weeks!!! not 9 hours due to dungeon lockouts. A PvP player can therefore PvP contstantly and recieve a new piece of gear every 10 hours (with a 100% droprate) or so where as a PvE player going through Karazhan must hope on the fact that the item s/he wants is going to drop on a rate sometimes as low as 8%, If the item then does not drop s/he has to wait another week to get another chance to get the item they want.
Another thing about moving straight from quest greens to pvp epics is u never learn to manage threat, use ur CC potential(if u have it) and in some cases that your class has a healing spell!! The fact is that these skills take time to learn (not the last one as much) and just going into an instance and having no clue why ur gettin attacked all the time while ur dpsing is just unacceptable imo. For this reason my heart sinks when i see ppl who think they are imba geared bcoz they have 6/7 pvp epics but the rest of thier gear is green.
Also when pvping alot of the time it feels like it is just 10/15/40 ppl working as individuals who just happen to have the same goal.
Im done now my hands hurt from so much typing
Post by
165807
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Post by
98207
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160222
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Post by
faia
its cost something
TIME!
and for beating something who not give basic anything (we not talk loot)
and the beating dools this time can kill you and not work like agro do
Post by
176164
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Post by
Coki
What are we supposed to PvP in if not PvP gear?
Post by
127003
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