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10.2.7
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Beta
New WotLK Druid info
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Post by
Celdhyrean
The new balance talents look fun (hurricane with no CD, 50% increased damage, and 100% spell pushback resistance + 10% additional damage FTW), daze on thorns and increased treant damage, haste proc, ...
However I'm wondering wether getting Intensity will still be a requirement to not be oomkin.
Because if it is, that's 13 to 15 (Master SHapeshifter) to put in the resto tree and those points are going to be hard to find.
Post by
Toldry
Feral
Resto
Balance
What do you think?
Post by
JamieK
the new talents really make my normal talent spec impossible if i want these new talents. lol
Post by
ignis86
Feral
Resto
Balance
What do you think?
i think your links were too long and didnt let me know what the heck i was really linking to.... (edited in the quote)
and i cant agree with 3 in imp mangle.. imo thats a useless talent...
for tanking thats what, 2 seconds off the cd??? meh useless there
and energy off mangle, which ferals in PvE should only be using for the debuff? no thanks
heres what i was looking at for feral
lvl 70
lvl 80
this is for raid tanking and dpsing.... if you would like explanations as to why i think im choosing what i am over something you prefer lemme know
Post by
Toldry
and i cant agree with 3 in imp mangle.. imo thats a useless talent...
for tanking thats what, 2 seconds off the cd??? meh useless there
and energy off mangle, which ferals in PvE should only be using for the debuff? no thanks
It helps alot while soloing though.
Post by
ignis86
no... pounce shredx2 fb or maim>shred you dont need to mangle spam unless you are in a rush....
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ignis86
no... pounce shredx2 fb or maim>shred you dont need to mangle spam unless you are in a rush....
typically while leveling, grinding or doing dailies you want to be through them asap. Sadly that means mangle spam.
when i meant rush as inpatient... i can still kill things just as fast if not faster with pounce>shred rotation due to lack of parries/blocks from behind... i actually tend to kill faster with pounce>shred than Mangle+moar Mangle
However I do agree that the imp. Mangle might be a bit of a let down. In cat form the energy reduction makes Mangles dpe ~= to a shred without mangle debuff. Shred is still the next option.
However I cant help but think that 2 less rage per mangle, while not much, could prove to be quiet useful.
You could probably shave 2 points out of Imp LotP (its of less use in raids) to make use of the points. Faster Mangles means faster threat building.
Im also unconvinced of the usefulness of Primal Precision for both tanking and dps. Depending on the itemization, this talent might prove to be a bit wasted tbh
There is at least one new to shred boosting it out in front again (Primal Aggression) meaning if we keep proper rip rotation our shreds do more dmg...
Imp Mangle doesn't lower rage cost at ALL, only energy (aka cat)
Faster mangle = more TPS? Yes, but 2.4seconds or so will NOT make enough of a difference to my 11-1200 tps in raids for me to justify the waste of 3 pts (imo)
And, everyone in my party healing themselves some when they crit, aka saving some healer mana is useless or less useful? i think not in raids, where mana conservation = VITAL
exptertise = good for tanking due to less parries aka boss doesn't swing faster on the next swing as often... and good for dps = less dodges.
Sure the energy refund part is useless for tanking, but there im talking about a spec to use for both and using
Thick Hide
has very little use for dps, its about blending the talents for a nice mix thats beneficial for both
*edited for correct cd reduction from speculated talent*
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ignis86
Imp Lotp gives 4% health per melee or range crit. Its of no use to casters.
O.o how often are YOU put in with the casters as a tank or dps? im either with other melee/ranged classes or with other Tanks...
A toon with 12k health only heals 480 every 6 seconds (assuming the crit every 6 seconds) thats very little healing when dealing with dots doing 1k+ per tick
ok.... 10 min boss fight = 600 seconds
480 every 6 seconds = 2880 health (a
healthstone+
equivalent) = 14400 health for the party... in some fights that can mean winning or losing...
not to MENTION when the tank crits and heals himself thats some more threat... melee can usually drop their own (feign or vanish)
With pounce/maim kill routine you can probably kill just as quick as mangle spam, but its the down time between pulls that slows it down. Factor in a few tightly packed mobs and its use is diminished further.
i dont stealth till im just outside aggro range meaning no real down time there....
and if its tightly packed chances are you swipe spam with mangles when ya can...
Post by
129046
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ignis86
Agree here. FB will still gimp our rotation, so from rip it's 30*0,8=24 energy refunded(if it misses). We already have berserk and the king of the jungle to boost our energy (and the mangle energy reduction talents to some degree). I find that a nice, but not worth the points. And are we really gonna miss 10 expertise? I really can't imagine so. Unless there comes some shocking data proving otherwise, I'll probably skip Primal Precision.
once you are hit capped the main way to up raid dmg outside of more crit and ap is to lower the dodge/ aka expertise... and with LOW feral druid dps viable items with expertise its nice... and that 24 energy could mean you shift a little less sooner when powershifting. (btw u said misses which seems to imply not if it is dodged... which i would include in "fails to land")
Another talent I'm finding problems with is the Master shapeshifter. Sure it's nice, but having to take natural shapeshifter. Blaah. That's 3 points wasted there, making it 5 point talent. Still, it's nice. Blizz is starting to give us actual choices. Good? Bad? Dunno.
Another thing in common was that the savage fury was dropped from most of the builds for the extra points. I guess for soloing it'be nice for that mangle spam, like the imp mangle. Then again, I too will probably max my tanking potential and skip em. Time will tell.
Can't tell you how much shifting i end up doing in raids to bres innervate spot HoT Etc Etc... lower mana cost on shifting back HELPS when you shift a lot.
Also, even before the new stuff is taken into consideration Claw and rake are a no-no when it comes to DpE.... they just stink... and Mangle should only be used in a raid if you are tanking, its trash, or the debuff isn't up on the boss.....
Post by
Erona
Feral
Lets see here, I chose this build because it has everything to increase DPS in Cat, and still everything needed to tank in Bear effectivly (missing only 3/3 Primal Tenacity). With King of the Jungle, 2x T4, and Omen of Clarity we should be regenerating more energy that Combat Rogues! Infected Wounds is a PvP talent imo, as I would assume most raid bosses would be immune to this debuff, but maybe not since Thunderclap is the same general effect.
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ignis86
Again i must say i cannot agree with Imp Mangle... that talent is useless IMO... Also 2 talents for 1 second more stun.... no TY... NOT useful while tanking ftmp... only while soloing or pvp.
take the 3 out of imp mangle and 2 out of bash and get tenacity... then i would accept that as something i might use...
no offense but those two talents i have to personally say no to lol.
Post by
144872
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ignis86
the reduction is 20%. The equates into a 20%+ threat increase from mangle. Seeing as mangle is out bread and butter threat generator, thats a decent increase imp and not one that should be dismissed so quickly.
assuming no misses?
12 second CD on Mangle
20% of 12 seconds is 2.4 seconds sorry i misposted as 1.5...
so mangle every 9.6 seconds... still not worth it for me... my tps is still way high enough without that... maybe its cause i dont socket pure stam like some tanks.. i like to add tps to my sockteting too... *shrug*
*edit*
also trading a few second off of mangle for some expertise for dps in cat and mitigation through not buffing the bosses attack speed by being parried trades it out nicely for me...
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
ignis86
10 points of Expertise would be the same as 39 Expertise rating. Assuming the mechanic doesn't change we need ~102 (I think) Expertise Rating to be capped. That talent would account for ~40% of our required expertise.
at lvl 70... what about 80?
Post by
109094
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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