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10.2.5
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10.2.6
One Reason tanks don't like to pug
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Post by
Cymorth
Hitting the need button is as good as declaring you want it, i tend to be courteous and ask on items that other people may use for example
ie on my shaman i was resto, but id say oh 2.7 1h axe with great enhance stats may i need if noone else wants? but thats if its a group of warrior,hunter etc who would benefit more than me as dps etc
but if it was a group where NOONE can use whatsoever then screw em lol
Worst i seen is pre tbc when somet dropped in Strat and the warrior needed it but back in the days of MasterLoot runs only the leader made everyone greed on it instead and warrior couldnt have it. he was damn %^&*ed and so was i and dont think i even knew him just hate annoying group leaders like that.
im sure it was a rare boe or may have been the epic barons sword. annoying when people make the rolling rules up as they go along. that group you had mate should have agreed on stuff before hand, if thjey didnt sod em
Post by
bwirum
Needing on that was perfectly acceptable and I wouldn't have lifted an eyebrow.
Post by
118084
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
xaratherus
Agreed with the majority here.
As a courtesy
I ask before I need.
But that's simply a courtesy. "Need before Greed" means just what it says: Anyone who needs an item to use it has priority over those who simply want it to vendor or DE. It shouldn't need an explanation, because the name of that loot setting says what needs to be said.
You wouldn't have to kick me from the group in the situation the OP described; had I needed an item and someone had the cojones to roll against me to shard it - because I was "rude" to choose the option that stated I needed it to use - I would've dropped group immediately. Or, if I was really ticked, and being a Paladin, I would've aggroed a few mobs for them to play with first,
then
dropped group before bubble-hearthing.
Post by
valundar
Oh, and FYI.. the enchanter has NO obligation to shard and let everyone roll on it. In fact.. if it isn't a guild run.. I usually won't.
I will greed on everything..... if you want to benefit from turning useless drops into valuable shards... by all means pick up enchanting and have at it.
If you did that and passed so you could DE then you kept it id kick you straight up.
If we all greeded and you won fine keep it your loot do what you want, but takeing and keeping is rude.
I would never take to de then keep. What I said was I don't offer my de ability. I greed on it. If I win it.. I de' it and keep. Just like those others in the grp would vendor it if they won the greed roll.
I say that because it is one of the perks to choosing enchanting... i get to make a 4-7 G vendor a 20G de.
Valundar
70 BE Paladin
Blackwing Lair
Post by
106896
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Post by
121787
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Post by
Philmckraken
Oh, and FYI.. the enchanter has NO obligation to shard and let everyone roll on it. In fact.. if it isn't a guild run.. I usually won't.
I will greed on everything..... if you want to benefit from turning useless drops into valuable shards... by all means pick up enchanting and have at it.
Valundar
70 BE Paladin
Blackwing Lair
By that logic, the rogue is under no obligation to share whatever he finds in the chests. He/she can simply wait until everyone leaves after the run, then go back and open them to get the loot for himself. If you want to benefit from all the valuable treasures in those chests, roll rogue.
Obviously, enchanting does not make you obligated to DE everything that drops for your PuG members; it would be considered "courteous" behaviour to offer to DE any BoP drops and have everyone roll for the results.
Post by
Lightrain
NEED = will wear it
GREED = will sell it
DE = GREED
Amen
To the enchanter guy. Blue=shard/void sphere. Non enchanters have to pay heavily to get a chance at them, and BoP gear isn't d/e'able if you aren't an enchanter. D/e is not obligitory, yes. It is the NICE, more profitable thing to do tho. If no one has a use for it, a vendor valued 3g blue is worth way more as a large prismatic shard worth 10-25g depending on the economy.
That's just a slap in the face to me. I ALWAYS ask if they want a d/e. If it's a good group, you d/e on the way thru, and roll at the end so hopefully everyone gets a shard if you all have good gear. Don't forget to roll for the shards at the end tho, and keep track of what d/e's on the need gear. Ninja'ing shards is a good way to make people mad.
To OP. I would have needed. Usually when I do tho, I act all excited. "OOOOH!" "may i need please?" They never say no. Being polite and asking goes a long way tho. Usually they just say "need if you need." And a group like that wouldn't complain
Post by
21577
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Post by
21577
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Post by
121787
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Post by
valundar
Do not shard a BoP for a fellow instance runner. That's fine, it isn't ruining someone's whole world.
It is a jerk move, it's unhelpful, and disrespectful, but then again, you didn't really need help with that instance, you could have soloed it on your own if you want. Besides, they aren't guildies you need to keep happy or keep from realizing you're selfish, they're just pickup puggers you will never see again.
Also make sure you do not ever roll on items from a chest a rogue unlocked, do not take any mage food, etc, etc, etc.
Enchanters aren't any more special in the "free with your mats" than other crafters, btw, and quite normally expect/get a tip. Even if this weren't true, it being offered as a reason to refuse DEing for the 4 other people you "chose" to group with, is pretty lame.
Again, your subscription, play how you want. I've been in groups where a mage has been asked for food/water and said "No". I think the same of them. I'll run with them once, then avoid them. I don't need food/water or the extra gold from a shard instead of selling the item, but I will remember the attitude of those people. They don't need tanks or healers, IMO.
Jerk Move?
How so?
I don't need to DE for anyone. Ever.
Do you see miners offering to roll on the ore they collect in the instance?? NO. Skinners on the leather?
NO.
Keep guild members happy??? What in the hell are you talking about.???
I do that because 99% of the people in my guild are nice. 99% of all puggers ive had the "pleasure" of grouping with are asses. And 100% of the people on my friends list are nice... (hence getting on that list)
That is why. It is from countless experiences. It has nothing to do with how the guild percieves me... I don't give a damn what anyone thinks of me.
(well... there are a very few that I do.. and they all are related to me, or have the ability to fire me from my job.)
You sir are a moron.
Log onto my server and ask.
I do DE on 99% of my runs. The way it works is I greed on everything I dont need. If they all pass, I de at end and we all roll on the shards. If they all greed as well... well then it is mine to do with as I please should I win.
No one ever knows when I do not disenchant for them.
I just never advertize that I am an enchanter unless asked.
Same thing.. if I am ever asked to de.. I ALWAYS will.
The mage that doesn't give water can and should be booted.
No Mage food? Fine... no buffs or heals 4 u then prick.
(It isn't necessary for me to advertize enchanting as an edge as I am damn good heals.. I dont need an .. "edge")
By that logic, the rogue is under no obligation to share whatever he finds in the chests. He/she can simply wait until everyone leaves after the run, then go back and open them to get the loot for himself. If you want to benefit from all the valuable treasures in those chests, roll rogue.
Obviously, enchanting does not make you obligated to DE everything that drops for your PuG members; it would be considered "courteous" behaviour to offer to DE any BoP drops and have everyone roll for the results.
As for lockpicking...
Just do what 90% of all rogues do... "I never leveled my lockpicking".. then they proceed to wait til after and go grab chest.
I used to offer my enchanting services.... 10,000 horrible pugs later.... No now I don't.
If anyone asks if there are any enchanters to DE i won't lie. I will de for everyone. I have just learned to not willfully give everyone else extra gold when there is a damn fine chance that they are pricks anyways. At least, unless they ask or until they show that they are the 1% that are decent people....(not an 11 year old ninja-looter)
(none of this applies to guild runs or if there are any that managed to make it on my friends list.)
Valundar
70 BE Paladin
BZlackwing Lair
Post by
121787
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
valundar
Same thing.. if I am ever asked to de.. I ALWAYS will.
The mage that doesn't give water can and should be booted.
No Mage food? Fine... no buffs or heals 4 u then prick.
If you always DE when asked, then nothing I said applies to you.. at all..
Your opinion of the mage, or of rogues that go back and pick after? I have the same. And enchanters who refuse to DE fall into the same group. No mage food, no de'ing.. basically a prick. You are not one of them, but I have been in groups where enchanters refuse. Or where I know they are a DE, but stay silent when asked. That's as pathetic as the rogue who sneaks back in.
I don't think I'm a moron for having the same opinion as you, but who knows?
Again, the point is that, in the situation we're talking about, not DEing a BoP that someone else wins... benefits the enchanter in no way whatsoever. It keeps the other person in the group from making more money = costs them gold. That's it. And sure, the skill allows you the ability to do that. You, fortunately, aren't one of those people, but they are out there.
What's the difference between a hunter who MDs on the healer just for fun, or the enchanter who refuses to DE for the group? One costs his group more money, and it's not the hunter.
If you don't like pugs, or go in assuming they are all a-hats, then you probably shouldn't be in pugs. And that's a very vaild viewpoint. But people who do pug, imo, should pull together, and that includes picking boxes, making food/water, buffs, and yes, DEing otherwise worthless items.
To bring it back to the topic, that's another reason tanks won't pug, because you run into way to many people with bad attitudes. You run with your guild, you know you'll get to roll on a shard. You run with a pug, and (some) enchanters get this idea that people shouldn't get to. People just go in with the idea to be generally more unhelpful in pugs.
The difference between the 2 is there. They BOTH cost gold.
The enchanter costs the winner a few gold that he could have made.
The hunter cost everyone in the group a repair bill.
That hunter is an asshat.
Benefits the enchanter in no way??
If all the enchanters did that. then the economy for the shards would go up... making the enchanter more profit.
Why shouldn't I go in pugs? I am damn good at what I do.
In 99% of all the pugs I go on... they would not have been able to do it except for me.
I totally enjoy the randomness of pugs... at times.
I do pull together, and keep them alive. I have 0 obligation to get them gold. That is what dailies are for.
That said.. It seems that we are in agreement on this issue.
It is very rare that people don't ask for enchanters to de... so it really doesnt matter to me anyhow... as I am ususlly de-ing anyways.
Valundar
70 BE Paladin
Blackwing Lair
Post by
121787
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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