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Roleplaying Dragons: Examining the taboo
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Post by
Atik
So, last night (actually 3 this morning... whatever....) I was talking to Light on Real ID. I mentioned that, for a while now, I've been wanting to bring the Redux whelp trio (Cora, Sasha, and Loki) into an RP as drakes. My reason being the hilarity would ensue.
However, he then brought up the fact that most dragons are OP in roleplays. When I tried to say they aren't that hard to balance, he said that most people aren't as good as making underpowered things that should be overpowered as I am.
Well, this brought us into a discussion of Dragons being overpowered in the first place. I mean, in both lore and in-game, two or three adventurers have shown to be more than capable of killing a drake. Dragons are dying by the dozens in WoW, to mortals and other dragons alike.
What all this amounts too however, is my statement that made him say to write this here:
Something is only OP if you write it to be OP.
Now, for me, it is easy to not write something as OP. But, in some occasions, it can prove tempting.
So I limit myself. I set limits on what my characters can do.
For example, I kept imagining Sasha as borderline OP. So I put a wall in my way. I made her wings deformed so she couldn't fly, took away any offensive breath weapons, and made her a pacifist.
The result was a fun character who isn't OP. And, imo, proves that we are more than capable of having dragon characters without this wierd taboo against it.
I'm not saying we should all have 20 dragons per RP, but it shouldn't be such a scary prospect when making a character.
Thoughts?
Post by
751416
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Post by
Adamsm
They are also massively over powered, as the standard character can't stand up to even a drake, since they are larger and have access to more magic then any mere character mortal. Not to mention how strong they are alone.
And yes, in game we wipe out hundreds of them at a time...but that's a game mechanic.
Post by
355559
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Post by
751416
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Post by
470415
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Post by
Atik
They are also massively over powered, as the standard character can't stand up to even a drake, since they are larger and have access to more magic then any mere character mortal. Not to mention how strong they are alone.
And yes, in game we wipe out hundreds of them at a time...but that's a game mechanic.
I remember your list about that, and I don't buy it. I don't think dragons are that "super-duper" more powerful than mortas.
1. Warriors are more than strong enough to survive blows from small dragons, and can go king kong on their jaws.
2. Mages can make hail the size of minivans fall from the sky and crush dragons easily.
3. Warlocks could ignite their insides and burn them alive. Or just seduce them with a succubus.
4. Druids can ground them with roots and tear them apart with a veriety of forms.
5. DKs have death grip to rip them out of the sky and otherwise turn them into a ragdolll, can raise small armies of undead, or just repeat warrior style.
6. Paladins are like super-powered warriors.
7. Shamans can call upon lightning and roast them mid-air.
8. Rogues could shadowstep or something onto the dragon's back and slit its throat.
And like I said, if you don't RP something as OP, it won't be OP.
Also, I don't see how Dragons are show-offy (okay, Locronos is, but meh.) If I had to list some characters that are who they are just for the RPers to show off?
Fal'Lok, Argona, Nagorm, Kaistra. (no offense to anyone.)
All of whom could kill dragons by the thousands. (Hell, Argona could just wish all of them dead...)
Post by
oneforthemoney
What you seem to be forgetting with your list here Atik is that Dragons are literally covered in armour, warriors being the equivalent of a tea kettle, where if you pour on enough heat it will start screaming and little else.
Their breath torches people, poisons them or otherwise with little more prep than an inhale, mage's requiring some time to cast thing like blizzard if the comic is to be believed. Plenty if time to be eaten or fricasseed.
Dragons, ancient as they are, would not be defenseless against magical attacks, particularly Legion magic as they have encountered them a few times in the course of their job. Defending the planet would generally direct one towards means to do so against a threat that has appeared frequently.
The largest a druid can get is a bear. So have fun scrabbling at those huge scales with those infantile claws, assuming the dragon doesn't just swipe you with his or, again, simply take off and breathe on you.
Dragons are extremely intelligent dinosaur sized creatures who can fly, ergo death grip is likely not going to have much real effect against something that massive.
For Shammies, have you seen how big a dragon is? Ignoring the no doubt mystic defenses all dragons would have, it takes a tremendous amount of constant current to kill a man, and a dragon is several times larger than one.
As for rogues, the whole scale things again and shadow step is a game mechanic.
The thing you seem to be doing Atik is thinking of dragon's as of mortal means. This is wrong. So very, very wrong. Read the Hobbit, (or maybe The Sellswords if you want a more scaled down version of a dragon) that is what a dragon is. Blizzard reduces their power in game so you can kill them.
Post by
229054
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Post by
Atik
The thing you seem to be doing Atik is thinking of dragon's as of mortal means. This is wrong. So very, very wrong. Read the Hobbit, (or maybe The Sellswords if you want a more scaled down version of a dragon) that is what a dragon is.
But those are not WoW dragons. We have no proof that a single swipe will kill someone, we have no stats for a dragon's bite force, ect.
Post by
306612
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Post by
Adamsm
The thing you seem to be doing Atik is thinking of dragon's as of mortal means. This is wrong. So very, very wrong. Read the Hobbit, (or maybe The Sellswords if you want a more scaled down version of a dragon) that is what a dragon is.
But those are not WoW dragons. We have no proof that a single swipe will kill someone, we have no stats for a dragon's bite force, ect.
Atik if you get swiped by a paw with claws longer then your body(in the case of a lot of the larger dragons), you'd be dead, no matter how much armour you are wearing; hell, we've seen in Lore that Dragon scales are incredibly sharp and one of the few things that can destroy their own armour. As for going King Kong on a snout....major issue with that? You are now in front of a maw, that, depending on the colour of the Dragon, is going to breath fire ice lightening poisonous mist or red hot magma into your face; bye bye mortal. That's how Marshall Windsor died to Onyxia; she transformed and flamed him to death.
A one on one fight, the mortal is going to lose against the Dragon. A fight between multiple mortals and one Dragon, the mortals have a better chance. But a flight of Dragons against the same group of mortals? Dead. Saw that in Mage, where the most the powerful members of the Tor could do was keep the shield spell up around Dalaran while the Blues whaled on it; if the traitor hadn't of been stopped, they would have dropped the city, even with most of the Six there protecting it.
Hell, look at the final death of Onyxia: King Varian times 2, with a pair of magic swords, a Druid who possess the talent to become an archdruid, a Blood Elf rogue who spent more time protecting Anduin and keeping whelps away without really being able to kill them like we do in game, Jaina Proudmoore, a small army of Stormwind and Ironforge forces....and they still just barely took her down.
Dragons are above the mortals of Azeroth for a reason after all; not to mention, if the Bronzes want to, they can make it so you can never kill them, without even touching: Just lots of rewinding of your personal time line, as we saw Nozdormu do to Krasus during Day of the Dragon.
Also, I don't see how Dragons are show-offy (okay, Locronos is, but meh.) If I had to list some characters that are who they are just for the RPers to show off?
Fal'Lok, Argona, Nagorm, Kaistra. (no offense to anyone.)You left out Philip. And who's Kaistra? Never heard of that one.
Post by
355559
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Post by
Monday
You left out Philip. And who's Kaistra? Never heard of that one.
Defensive much?
Post by
Adamsm
And I'm still waiting on bliz to explain just how all the twilights are dying then.Mainly because it's been more then just one or two mortals slaughtering them; it's been armies of mortals fighting together.
Edit: And it's a good question; if he's going to name drop, at least spell the name right.
Edit 2: And I'm sorry if he sees Kalistra as a show off character, but there isn't anything I can do about that; in all honesty, I feel the exact same way about all of his creations, as they all seem the same to me.
Post by
355559
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Monday
Just like how all of your character are stuck up snobs incapable of development? You know, next time you try and make a snide comment about our writing skills, don't waste our time and just say it openly.
^
Also: There are things called typos. No need to get pissy about one.
Post by
Adamsm
Okay, backing off here as I don't want to get the thread locked for going off topic.
On topic: Standing by the fact that we've seen it in lore that one man against a Dragon even a drake doesn't ever end well; same thing can easily happen with RP'ing one as if someone is feeling like they are on the losing end and shouldn't be, can just have the character transform and eat the other character.
Post by
Behelich
Pulling a Get Out Of Hell card out of their arse isn't exclusive to dragon rpers. Likewise, someone who respects those he plays with will not do something like that just because his character is a dragon.
Post by
588688
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