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Moral Ambiguity (Grey Vs Grey) Vs Black Vs White Morality
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Post by
588688
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Post by
367020
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Post by
91278
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Post by
Adamsm
A hero such as Starman, who is bi-poplar
He's a weeping willow half the time.
And a crouching moron, hidden badass when he actually fights heh.
Post by
588688
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Post by
Adamsm
I also don't find such characters realistic (which I've seen plenty of people describe morally ambiguous characters as), I think someone who is constantly changing their moral codes probably has bipolar disorder or something of that sort. I don't think I've ever met anyone who confused me on their morals, and I know tons of people. Everyone I've met can be descriped as a good decent person or a massive prick, and they aren't ambiguous about it either.
You don't know many deep people then; quite a few of my friends go back and forth between 'good' and 'prick' quite often, as do a lot of other people I know.
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367020
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Post by
gamerunknown
Yes, but one is talking about realism in a fantasy setting. Sure, there aren't clearly defined boundaries in real life, but there aren't marauding orcs that express their desire to kill, rape and pillage every human they see. It's like arguing about the most effective technique to kill a zombie, it depends on where the zombie appears and who wrote the role.
Post by
588688
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Post by
Adamsm
Yes, but one is talking about realism in a fantasy setting. Sure, there aren't clearly defined boundaries in real life, but there aren't marauding orcs that express their desire to kill, rape and pillage every human they see. It's like arguing about the most effective technique to kill a zombie, it depends on where the zombie appears and who wrote the role.
This, in a fantasy world, realism isn't very needed. Especially in WoW with creatures like the old gods, beings that thrive off pure chaos.
But that's the thing: You have the Legion and the Old Gods to be the Black of the Azeroth universe, while the Horde and the Alliance as they are now are the Whites; but within those are the grays all over the place. If someone is writing a book that involves the factions, it has to be a gray vs gray because neither side is actually evil.
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588688
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Post by
Adamsm
Unless it's warhammer online, still though, while I agree that the playable factions may be grey only because of the fact that not every last single person in the two massive factions (which include civilians of the races of the factions) could possibly be good, but I can't think of any single specific characters in the warcraft universe that are not black or white.
Either way both factions are like you said in the white morality category, but have their black category members because they are both so massive, and include civilians as well, that it is unbelievable that even in a fantasy world, such massive organizations could be 100% good. I can however by such organizations being 100% evil (like every PVE villain faction such as the burning legion and the scourge) due to it being a fantasy, and the leader can have completle magical dominance over his or her followers, or they could all be corrupted, every last one of them, making them evil.
Closest thing in the Warcraft universe to a pure 'White hat' race are the Draenei and the Tauren, but considering that both of them do have darker portions, they are about the only one. But that's why the factions are gray as opposed to black or white; but yes, the evil groups are all 'black hats' in the Azeroth universe.....well, sometimes: Kael'thas is actually a Gray villain compared to the other big Bads of the BC era, as every single thing he was doing was about his people instead of for personal power like Illidan or KJ or because they were insane and working for someone more powerful like Vashj.
Post by
588688
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367020
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Post by
Adamsm
I think Kael'thas was white at first in warcraft, then his morality increasingly darkened over the course of the burning crusade, to the final encounter with him in magister's terrace when you see that he is completely evil, saying before he dies that everyone will drown in their own blood and that the world will burn, showing what a complete degenerate monster he became.
Eh, considering how even when he joined up with the Legion, he was still plotting to turn all of the demons into power batteries for his people.....that's still in the gray territory.
As for those who are always gray: The Forsaken are the best example considering how they are portrayed all over, with Sylvanas firmly as a gray hat. The new Grimtotems who are part of the Tauren are the same, as are the Ashtongues of the Broken/Draenei.
Post by
588688
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Post by
Adamsm
If the Forsaken and Sylvanas were pure Black, they wouldn't be part of the Horde, and both factions would be trying to kill them all. They fall under the Gray.
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367020
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Post by
588688
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Post by
Adamsm
And I disagree completely.
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