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Holy changes: what's the new consensus?
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Post by
Onijitsu
Just wanted to see what you guys think of the absorbs you're getting out of the new Holy mastery.
And, while you're at it, how does Holy "feel" now? I notice I'm OOMing
much
more easily, and have to be more careful than every about what I cast, when. I also love how Holy Light will transmit 100% through Beacon. (Mana efficiency FTW!)
Post by
560638
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849617
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Post by
Flonnette
I definitely see and feel the changes to mana. I definitely see and feel and like the change to Word of Glory. I definitely see and feel the change to Beacon/Holy Light too. I probably need a couple of weeks for a "final verdict" sort of thing.
Edit: After looking at last night's reports, Word of Glory for me went from "bottom of the list" to 5th which is much much much better than before. That puts the "power" of Word of Glory around Holy Shock.
Post by
Onijitsu
Holy crap... I just noticed the +20% crit change to
. This may be worth reglyphing to extend it another 10 seconds. (or 50% longer with +20% crit!)
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299926
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708552
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Post by
Flonnette
The shift in mana is actually quite easy to see where it has nothing to do with the return on Judgment but the amount going out. Or in other words, we simply can't case as many Divine Light as we used too before going OOM.
And after another night of raiding I definitely see the effect of Critical on DPS.
Although unplanned, I found I could "charge up" my Illuminated Healing shield to 45k on a bunch of "false starts" before the real pull had to be made. The problem with doing this is that it takes a big chunk of time to build up without spending a bunch of mana and makes it rather clunky as a pre-fight as a tactic.
Post by
Onijitsu
BTW... everyone notice the conspicuous lack of spirit on Tier-12 and same-level gear? (Such as the cape and the belt you can get for being Friendly or Honored in the Firelands?)
That Tier-12 2-piece bonus will be extremely important for all Healers to get, ASAP.
Post by
pezz
Here's what that bonus does: Holy shock (7% base mana) gets a 40% chance to grant 6% base mana. This averages out to 2.4% base mana refunded every cast, which means Holy Shock essentially costs 4.6% base mana, and that is all the mana returns you get.
Now, two pieces are spirit/haste, so there is good reason to get your two piece, but still, that's not huge mana savings. I'd be willing to bet in terms of pure mana savings 4 p t11 > 2p t12.
Post by
DramaliaSh
I'm kinda wondering about this myself, but guys:
- Who among you are healing with holy light?
I found im only using my HL when crusade is up, else simply judging + HS + DL is way more than enough for me to full someone quickly, HR for AoE (with a sweet 20 secs CD now) and then WoG till your mouse burns :)
Still never waste or misses mana...
Yet i've seen people that are using HL all the time saying its mana efficient, but they are never able to keep the party/raid full within respective time. A lot of those players are way better geared than me (you can look me up
here
.
If you judge on every CD, HS on every CD, emphasis on DL when Infusion of Light happens, and WoG when youre full of Power, i still just found HL is good when crusade pops... (that does some neat 80k+ heals ^^)
Tell me what you think!
Post by
Onijitsu
I use Holy Light as often as I judge it possible to do so. I know it's not easy when the damage is coming in, hot and heavy, but it conserves your mana (and lets you heal TWO targets for the price of one!) until you really need to start pouring it on. If
Infusion of Light
procs, then it's an awesome way to squeeze out the heals without putting the squeeze on your mana supply.
You can also use the
New & Improved!
™ to punch out a ton of Holy Lights in a very short period of time. And the newly-added +crit of this buff will stack with the Tier-11 2-piece for some nice HPS/HPM.
Post by
Flonnette
In a standard fight, a Holy Paladin should be casting Holy Light relative to how much they cast Divine Light. For most fights, that usually means roughly 20 Divine Lights and 20 Holy Lights where you shift to one or the other spell depending on the healing assignment.
Holy Light is mana efficient and while Holy Shock is mana efficient too, Holy Light has more "throughput" which is why it is used just as much as Divine Light. Its almost like Blizzard designed the mathematics to be that way.
Post by
hawke
I find it hard to really optimize the use of Holy Light. Don't really heal for much (at least, it's way better since last patch :-)) compared to Divine Light, so when tank take heavy damage, Holy Light really won't do much. I heal raid members with Holy Light tho, but I can really only do that if damage is minimal or I know tank won't take a crap ton of damage soon...
I don't know, are you guys only using Holy Light after some procs or something ? What can I do to actually make Holy Light a bit more worthwhile ? Let's take an average raid boss, I probably cast DL twice as much as holy light. I don't really have mana problems, but if it's suppose to be the same, I'm wondering what the hell am I doing :P.
Post by
Flonnette
Healing in Cata seems to be more about the in fight situation where waiting for procs is going to get players killed. Although a bulk of my Cata raiding experience is healing in 10 raids, I can't imagine it is very different in 25. The way encounter dynamics work currently, if the even is run "correctly" then the boss encounters is constantly pumping out X amount of DPS to various parts of the raid where healers need to match that. Waiting for procs doesn't help this at all.
The numbers I cite in posts are purely based on my unscientific observation of my performance in Cata raids. Its not a hard rule but I normally expect in a 5 minute fight, I will end up casting a combination of about 50 Holy Lights and Divine Lights. Its more a question of time than the spell: In a 5 minute fight given how the GCD works you can probably only pull off about 50 casts of a channeled spells while weaving in beneficial instant effects (I can see this in the Arcane Mage DPS report as well). How many of those 50 casts that are Holy Light or Divine Light is up to the player where hopefully they choose a good ratio.
Post by
pezz
I find using HR at pretty much every opportunity covers any small amounts of damage I'd possibly use HL for, only it does it 6 or 7 people at a time. On Cho'gall on Tuesday HR was at the top of my healing done for the first time ever. DL was second or third and HL was like sixth I think. If one person is being hit, DL, if a lot of people are being hit HR. Don't really know what niches HL and FoL have, personally.
Side note: the fact that HR (and beacon, which I didn't mention) are always two of my top three heals is why I will never stack mastery until they work with it.
Post by
Onijitsu
Actually, someone told me that mastery DOES work with Holy Radiance. It just didn't work well, for almost any Hpally spell, before the 4.2 change. But now that the absorb which a given heal provides can stack...? But even before the 4.2 change to mastery, a very, very good Hpally told me that mastery still had a few, rare uses.... such as, with stacking up in Chim, and using Holy Radiance to heal the group. Our previously crap-mastery actually helped, in that rare situation, back then, to mitigate some damage decently. Do correct me if my info is wrong.
And yes, only heals pass through the beacon. More's the pity. But Beacon is still amazing, IMHO. Drop a big heal/absorb on one target, and get a free heal on another one. Every time I heal on one of my other toons, I miss my beacon severely.
Regardless, I definitely feel the difference in targets I've been healing, now. Not enough to place mastery over haste, but I do very much like the absorbs.
Post by
Flonnette
Illuminated Healing doesn't happen with Holy Radiance and it is easy to check. Just stand there and hit it and you'll never see Illuminated Healing pop up.
Post by
Onijitsu
Heh. Good point. I'll have to tell the guy he's dead wrong. I usually like checking things for myself, but this guy was so good with his other advice that I took it at face value.
What about Light of Dawn? Does that produce Illuminated Healing? I wonder if that's what he meant. I currently don't even use Light of Dawn, since it's generally not as useful in 10-man content... but as my Spirit has gotten much higher, I may move a point from Enlightened Judgements into it. (I've had a point in Blessed Life instead, both for PvP purposes, and because I get a bit of Holy Power in PvE encounters as well)
Methinks I'd like to ask the author of VuhDo to consider some capability which would reflect the strength of Illuminated Healing on a given target, at any given time. (He's excellent at responding to requests... one of the reasons I recommend VuhDo above other addons)
Post by
pezz
Light of Dawn does proc Illuminated healing.
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