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USA voting day
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Post by
wolfeyoung
Going to the polls and voting blank may show a sign of voter dissent.
When you go to vote, you must tell them that you're there, they then check your name to see if you're registered to vote. They do this to insure that someone else doesn't come along and say that they are you. Hence, it is recorded that you showed up to vote, though not which party you voted for.
How would this show voter dissent. If 200 mil people showed up to vote, but only 150 mil actually voted, then that would send a message to government of a possible protest.
Post by
Orranis
Just be sure to exercise the right that many have died to ensure you still have.
GO VOTE!
I don't have the right to vote.
Post by
HiVolt
Apathy Kills.
Not voting isn't apathy if it isn't done out of apathy.
Like I said earlier, it can be a perfectly justifiable form of protest.
Protest != Apathy.
Except for the fact that convincing yourself that not voting = protest does not make it true.
And convincing yourself that your vote counts on a national level is just as much of a delusion.
Please, feel free from trying to push your own values onto others by telling them they should vote because it's what an American citizen should do. By all means, vote, but as I said earlier and as other have said throughout the entirety of this thread- NEVER VOTE JUST BECAUSE YOU SHOULD.
I absolutely refuse to cast a ballot that supports a flawed and corrupt political system, and any reasonable person would see that such an act is indeed a protest and a legitimate one at that.
Also, try to refrain from argument if you can't make a valid counterpoint. The only thing you're furthering is your apparent ignorance on the subject.
Post by
Baryetarir
And convincing yourself that your vote counts on a national level is just as much of a delusion.
Please, feel free from trying to push your own values onto others by telling them they should vote because it's what an American citizen should do. By all means, vote, but as I said earlier and as other have said throughout the entirety of this thread- NEVER VOTE JUST BECAUSE YOU SHOULD.
I absolutely refuse to cast a ballot that supports a flawed and corrupt political system, and any reasonable person would see that such an act is indeed a protest and a legitimate one at that.
Also, try to refrain from argument if you can't make a valid counterpoint. The only thing you're furthering is your apparent ignorance on the subject.
^ this
Post by
374287
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Just not doing something isn't really a protest. It's like saying not doing drugs is a protest of marijuana. I honestly don't care if you don't vote, but don't try and make it something it's not.
Post by
HiVolt
Just not doing something isn't really a protest. It's like saying not doing drugs is a protest of marijuana. I honestly don't care if you don't vote, but don't try and make it something it's not.
I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't vote does so out of protest. I'll agree that most people who don't vote do it only out of apathy.
However, personally, I have refused to vote while informing others of the detrimental effects on American politics that our current system endorses. I've done this on multiple websites- attempting to inform others. That is what makes my case a protest- because my not voting is the backing action(or inaction, if you will) of my objection to the current American political system.
My main reasoning for thinking this right now is all of the polarization and extremism I've seen in the news media, especially from political ads, over the course of the past month and I have grown tired of it. I may return to the polls in 2012 even if nothing has changed, but right now, I don't want any part of the system that only serves to divide the American people and hinder progress.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't vote does so out of protest.
Neither am I. I'm saying that not voting itself is not a protest.
Protesting involves doing something above and beyond in response to a particular action someone does or belief someone holds.
You don't protest abortions by not having an abortion, you protest abortions by doing something in response to the abortions that are being committed.
You don't protest communism by not being a communist, you protest communism by organizing against it.
Etc. etc.
Post by
HiVolt
I'm not saying that everyone who doesn't vote does so out of protest.
Neither am I. I'm saying that not voting itself is not a protest.
Protesting involves doing something above and beyond in response to a particular action someone does or belief someone holds.
You don't protest abortions by not having an abortion, you protest abortions by doing something in response to the abortions that are being committed.
You don't protest communism by not being a communist, you protest communism by organizing against it.
Etc. etc.
Protest
:
1. a solemn declaration of opinion and usually of dissent.
By the very first definition listed- my non-act is indeed a protest. It may not be a protest in the traditional political sense- but it is indeed a protest.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Protest
:
1. a solemn declaration of opinion and usually of dissent.
By the very first definition listed- my non-act is indeed a protest. It may not be a protest in the traditional political sense- but it is indeed a protest.
And not voting is not a declaration of anything.
Post by
HiVolt
Protest
:
1. a solemn declaration of opinion and usually of dissent.
By the very first definition listed- my non-act is indeed a protest. It may not be a protest in the traditional political sense- but it is indeed a protest.
And not voting is not a declaration of anything.
Perhaps not the act itself- but when given context by informing others of the reason behind the non-act?
That falls firmly under declaration.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Protest
:
1. a solemn declaration of opinion and usually of dissent.
By the very first definition listed- my non-act is indeed a protest. It may not be a protest in the traditional political sense- but it is indeed a protest.
And not voting is not a declaration of anything.
Perhaps not the act itself- but when given context by informing others of the reason behind the non-act?
That falls firmly under declaration.
You also ate breakfast in the context. Does that make that a protest too?
You informing others is an act of protest. One of the lamest forms, but a protest nonetheless. You not voting still isn't a protest.
Post by
HiVolt
Protest
:
1. a solemn declaration of opinion and usually of dissent.
By the very first definition listed- my non-act is indeed a protest. It may not be a protest in the traditional political sense- but it is indeed a protest.
And not voting is not a declaration of anything.
Perhaps not the act itself- but when given context by informing others of the reason behind the non-act?
That falls firmly under declaration.
You also ate breakfast in the context. Does that make that a protest too?
You informing others is an act of protest. One of the lamest forms, but a protest nonetheless. You not voting still isn't a protest.
Fair enough. I'll concede to that point. Not voting, by itself, is not a protest. But, I'm glad we could reach a little common ground here. :D
Post by
DarkOpeth
Well. If you have been keeping track, let me provide an updated. The democrats got CRUSHED across the board. They will be retaining the Senate, but losing the House. JOHN @#$%ING BOEHNER is going to be speaker.... this is NOT what this country needs.
So to all democrats here: did you enjoy this sodomization? Welcome the the post-Citizens United world. If this keeps up, our elections will be about as meaningful as the ones held in Iran.
The amount of money spent by Democrats, Unions and left-leaning institutions and funds this election: around 200 million. (pretty standard for a nationwide midterm.
The amount of money spent by Republicans, CoCs, and right-leaning institutions and individuals: Three !@#$ing BILLION. Welcome to Citizens United. Democrats got outspent 15 to 1, and the results reflect that.
You want change? The results of this election effectively disarm and incapacitate President Obama, and the rest of the democrats remaining. They can say goodbye to any Legislative hopes. As one of my friends said:
Corporations are not people.
Money is not speech.
It's time to get back to basics.
I choose to stand with those leaders and elected officials who tell the inconvenient truth.
I'm glad I have a home and citizenship in the EU. The stupid Americans get and deserve the irreversible damage that's coming. I feel no pity. Idiots.
I'm out.
Post by
wolfeyoung
The amount of money spent by Democrats, Unions and left-leaning institutions and funds this election: around 200 million. (pretty standard for a nationwide midterm.
The amount of money spent by Republicans, CoCs, and right-leaning institutions and individuals: Three !@#$ing BILLION. Welcome to Citizens United. Democrats got outspent 15 to 1, and the results reflect that.
Show me your source for this info. According to the Wall Street Journal, the funds were nearly the same. Also, traditionally, Democrats usually have more funds then Republicans, and this only by a slight margin, but because of the recent Supreme Court Ruling, it allowed for outside contributions to rise.
Post by
136555
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
valundar
Apathy Kills.
Not voting isn't apathy if it isn't done out of apathy.
Like I said earlier, it can be a perfectly justifiable form of protest.
Protest != Apathy.
Except for the fact that convincing yourself that not voting = protest does not make it true.
And convincing yourself that your vote counts on a national level is just as much of a delusion.
Please, feel free from trying to push your own values onto others by telling them they should vote because it's what an American citizen should do. By all means, vote, but as I said earlier and as other have said throughout the entirety of this thread- NEVER VOTE JUST BECAUSE YOU SHOULD.
I absolutely refuse to cast a ballot that supports a flawed and corrupt political system, and any reasonable person would see that such an act is indeed a protest and a legitimate one at that.
Also, try to refrain from argument if you can't make a valid counterpoint. The only thing you're furthering is your apparent ignorance on the subject.
Then you can continue to sit and let others steer your life... that is also your right.
But don't try and say that it doesn't matter.. because the fact is.. it does.
Who is in charge determines how much you pay in taxes. How much companies pay. (which comes back to you.. and which companies leave for cheaper countries.)
What you can and cannot do.
Who you can and cannot marry.
Where you can and cannot build.
Who receives funding and who does not.
The list goes on and on.
And guess who decides who is in charge? Definitely not the lazy, apathetic, "protesters" who stay at home rather than going to the polls to cast their ballots.
Furthermore... any reasonable person sees your argument as what it is... an selfish and lazy attempt to push the problems off for others to handle.
Ask any of the stoners in california who were too lazy to go out and vote what happened to their bill to legalize marijuana.
Post by
374287
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
HiVolt
Then you can continue to sit and let others steer your life... that is also your right.
But don't try and say that it doesn't matter.. because the fact is.. it does.
Who is in charge determines how much you pay in taxes. How much companies pay. (which comes back to you.. and which companies leave for cheaper countries.)
What you can and cannot do.
Who you can and cannot marry.
Where you can and cannot build.
Who receives funding and who does not.
The list goes on and on.
And guess who decides who is in charge? Definitely not the lazy, apathetic, "protesters" who stay at home rather than going to the polls to cast their ballots.
Furthermore... any reasonable person sees your argument as what it is... an selfish and lazy attempt to push the problems off for others to handle.
Ask any of the stoners in california who were too lazy to go out and vote what happened to their bill to legalize marijuana.
First, if you're going to be condescending- make sure you read the rest of the thread before you post. I am not apathetic toward voting. In fact, I am the exact opposite. I am passionate about voting in the sense that one knows and understands that for which they are voting. I am also passionate about the current state of the American political system and thus have chosen not to endorse it
in the current election
by not voting and informing others of the reasons not to vote.
I have never meant to insinuate that voting itself is unimportant- because it is. But in our political system, at a national level, one person does not and cannot have a voice unless he or she is already an elected official.
Voting absolutely matters- but not in a political system where the only option for the populace at a national level is referendum and that referendum is presented only by representatives of minority groups, one group at one polar extreme and the other at the opposite end of the spectrum, within the American people.
Tell me, when was the last time that you decided on what should be on a ballot, rather than just voting for what is already on a ballot? How many Independents or Tea Partiers or Greens or Libertarians or Socialists, etc. have you seen actually voted into a federal office without having to call themselves Republicans or Democrats? For that matter, how many have you seen on a ballot? How often does it seem like you're voting for the exact same thing without any progress toward your personal political goals?
Your freedom of choice isn't as big as you think it is and it certainly doesn't make as much of an impact as you think it does.
Yes, voting is important. But understanding why you vote(or don't vote) and what you vote for is infinitely more important.
Don't paint me as apathetic- because if I were apathetic I wouldn't have even made the trouble to post in this thread.
Post by
Pwntiff
valundar, I understand what you are saying, but on the other hand it's people like you that make this system as ineffective as it is.
A single vote out of three hundred million means jack. The problem is there is a larger emphasis on "You must vote!" than "You must know why you are voting the way you do." That mentality causes a lot of the inefficiencies we have when people turn up to vote when they don't know:
the issues
the candidates' campagins
at least the bare basics of the system
I can almost guarantee that President Bush's campaign of "I will ban same-same marriage" would not have held water if the major of the population realized the federal government can't do that without infringing on states' rights, and yet that was a large part of his campaign.
I don't vote in my state's elections because either I'll agree with Republican's views and vote for the clear winner, or I'll agree with the Democrat's views and vote for the clear loser. In my state, at the gubernatorial level, my vote truly does not matter. I don't vote at the local level because in a town of four thousand, who you know is more important than what you say. Again, in my city elections, my vote truly does not matter because I would vote for the candidates who see they way I do on issues, but they aren't the ones going to be elected because that would involve changing the status quo.
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