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1-85 is daunting for new players.
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Post by
313143
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
skumbananer
Blizz should encourage raiding as you level. Dont know how that should be done though, something optional and fun, and rewarding to raid with people around your own level without getting boosted by max level characters.
So you should get encouraged to spend more time at around lvl 58-62 and do old azeroth lvl60 raids for a while, then stop some at 68-72 for outland raids and karazhan, and then stop a while at around 80 for wotlk raids.
levelling is a really fun part of the game the first and second time around, and to just rush to max level in the shortest amount of time kinda spoils that part.
Post by
Pwntiff
They currently actually discourage raiding to level, because raids get a huge XP penalty.
And it's only a rush to max level if you make it one.
Post by
304214
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
304214
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Astygia
They currently actually discourage raiding to level, because raids get a huge XP penalty.
since when?
all ive did since i hit lvl 15 was raid and pvp with my alt.and it seems to be pretty good exp(although,ive found out that tanking isnt really a good way to try to relieve stress
Since forever...you get hardly any exp in a raid. I think you're thinking of 5mans, which are great ways to level.
I agree that finding a way to get more newbies raiding is an awesome idea, but how to implement some kind of system to make it more profitable, I dunno.
Post by
304214
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Pwntiff
raids as in 10 and 25 mans?
what idiot would let some scrub not even lvl 80 in there 10 or 25 man? i know i sure the hell wouldnt
What idiot wouldn't let a 60+ into a 60 raid or a 70+ into 70 raid?
Post by
Astygia
raids as in 10 and 25 mans?
what idiot would let some scrub not even lvl 80 in there 10 or 25 man? i know i sure the hell wouldnt
You're misunderstanding :P
What he/she meant, and I agree too, was that there should be some inventive way (other than yelling about it in /2) to get new folks into the raid scene as they level up. LFD has done a lot of good in sort of forcing folks to learn their role in a 5-man team (yes, there's still bads, I'm speaking generally though), because not only does it teach them how to team, it's great experience.
If there were some actually good way to get folks in their lower 60s and 70s hitting the appropriate raid instances, they'd be a heck of a lot more prepared and motivated when they ding 80.
Of course I have no idea how to implement such a feature but it'd be pretty cool to see.
EDIT: Well, making LFR (looking for raid) cross-server puggable...could work. Would require dramatic reworking of the loot rolling system in order to make it fair, since Need/Greed/DE, handy as it is, still isn't quite right even in 5mans, so in raids it would lead to a lot of QQ. Just an idea.
Post by
qwertydood
The number doesn't really matter, it can be 10000 or 4, the only thing that matters is how long it takes.
I'm sorry, but that is just false. If a game has 10000 levels, no matter how long it takes, it will always SEEM longer than a game with 4 levels.
The OP is talking about how
daunting
85 levels seems, not how long it actually takes.
I think
you're
missing the point, which is: So what? You're speaking as if a brand new player should be able to pick up a game, hit max level, and be geared up within a few hours/days/whatever timeframe is comfy for you.
On the contrary, I think I'm the only one addressing what the OP said. The point is that 85 levels seems daunting if you have heard nothing about the game and just picked it up. The amount of levels =/= amount of content, but with the knowledge that the real content of the game starts at max level, the idea of having to level up 84 times is daunting.
Post by
Astygia
On the contrary, I think I'm the only one addressing what the OP said. The point is that 85 levels seems daunting if you have heard nothing about the game and just picked it up. The amount of levels =/= amount of content, but with the knowledge that the real content of the game starts at max level, the idea of having to level up 84 times is daunting.
See, that's the problem right there.
The game doesn't 'start at max level'. That's a pretty commonly thrown around term but unless you weren't actually playing your guy for the previous 84 levels it's simply untrue, especially if you're a brand new player where you probably haven't even heard the term 'endgame' as it applies to WoW. It's not even a contextual reference for such a person yet.
The leveling up process is experiencing the gameworld,
enjoying the journey
up to the endgame level, learning how things work and how your class works, learning new abilities and how to use them in PvE/PvP, seeing what the future holds for your fresh young toon and looking forward to new stuff, basically enjoying the game as a whole and hungering to see more of it. Not just rushing through to the end so you can get shiny epics and stand around looking important.
If you look at WoW as a job, or don't care about anything but the endgame, then sure I guess it would be daunting, but if we apply a little common sense we can easily see how such an outlook simply doesn't apply to newbies, which is what the OP was getting at. If it's the game they are considering spending time and money on because it looks good, then...it's the third large-scale expansion of a globally popular game and full of things to do, which to me says fun, not daunting.
Post by
Pwntiff
I have three 80s, a 79, and four others between 19 and 47. I enjoy the endgame as much as the leveling process. It's just certain "mandatory" zones I dislike an cause me to stall. Outland and Northrend I enjoy completely, but some Vanilla zones, like STV, are what cause be to give up on a class for a while.
Post by
Astygia
That's fair...we all have particular zones we don't like. STV is one of my least favorite hubs as well, regardless of the faction. But thanks to LFD though it's nowhere near as necessary as it used to be, the last two (or three maybe) toons I've brought up to 80 avoided STV, Feralis, Felwood, the Blackrock area, and Winterpsring (my least favorite zones) completely.
Whether it's questing, LFD, BGs, or good old fashioned grinding, there's so many fast and easy ways to level up in today's WoW, I just don't see how any of it could be a drag, especially if you're a brand new person who's still marveling at the gameworld.
Only thing I can agree being slightly a PITA, is after having leveled x classes to 80 and geared them already, then rolling and raising another of the same class on another server or what have you. At that point, sure I can agree that there's a level of boredom and impatience (God I've done this x times already, gief heroics pls), but that won't apply to the new folks.
Post by
466163
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
qwertydood
If you look at WoW as a job, or don't care about anything but the endgame, then sure I guess it would be daunting, but if we apply a little common sense we can easily see how such an outlook simply doesn't apply to newbies, which is what the OP was getting at. If it's the game they are considering spending time and money on because it looks good, then...it's the third large-scale expansion of a globally popular game and full of things to do, which to me says fun, not daunting.
Your post hilariously glorified the leveling process.
I know plenty of people (at least 7) who have started the game and decided that it was not worth it to try to get to 80 because after the first 40 levels they realized how much longer it would take to get to 80. The first 40 levels are a lot of "I'm learning my class, discovering the nuances of the game", but the fact of the matter is that most players,
especially
new ones, upon reaching level 40 are thinking "I can't wait until I get to 80" and not "I'm glad I have another 40 levels of this fantastic content". While there may be a group of players who agree with you and think the latter, the fact of the matter is that this group makes up an undeniably low demographic.
TL:DR, Most players aren't appreciating the leveling content all the way up to 80 (soon 85), and a lot of new players drop off at 40 or so because the thought of investing time into another 40 levels is daunting. Therefore I think it is safe to assume that PLENTY of new players will find the 85 level cap to be daunting.
Post by
Leduan
I am a HUNTER i sleep and think about wow i think about wow when i`m not asleep i quit wow 2 years ago and will restart after Cataclysm from scratch.
A real warcraft fan does not complain.
Nuff said...
OH and i forgot. if you just zoom past everything how will you learn anything about the game if not easy step by step.
Post by
Robyn
OP is right... but then, when you've already got 11 million players, and the new ones are mostly friends of someone who is already playing, it doesn't matter so much that you miss out on a few. Blizz is probably more worried about all the new folks who are playing FTP games.
Post by
Astygia
Your post hilariously glorified the leveling process.
I would say I defined the leveling process, but again that's just me and I play because I enjoy playing, not because of some driven need to be at endgame
right now
.
I know plenty of people (at least 7) who have started the game and decided that it was not worth it to try to get to 80 because after the first 40 levels they realized how much longer it would take to get to 80. The first 40 levels are a lot of "I'm learning my class, discovering the nuances of the game", but the fact of the matter is that most players,
especially
new ones, upon reaching level 40 are thinking "I can't wait until I get to 80" and not "I'm glad I have another 40 levels of this fantastic content". While there may be a group of players who agree with you and think the latter, the fact of the matter is that this group makes up an undeniably low demographic.
With a paying subscriber base of however many (6? 13? numbers vary and I'm not sure) million, it seems most players actually don't find the process too rough to handle. If those 7 people of yours, along with however many others couldn't be bothered leveling up because it's just not worth their time, gearing up and learning their class at endgame would have been too much for 'em anyway, since it takes aaages longer to hone your skills and gear up at endgame than it does to just reach the endgame.
TL:DR, Most players aren't appreciating the leveling content all the way up to 80 (soon 85), and a lot of new players drop off at 40 or so because the thought of investing time into another 40 levels is daunting. Therefore I think it is safe to assume that PLENTY of new players will find the 85 level cap to be daunting.
Again, I would think the number of paying subs heavily disagrees with this outlook...but regardless, at the end of the day it's a game, if you read the back of the box and think the level cap sounds fun then you're in, if you think it sounds like too much then you're gonna go with something else. However mean it sounds (it's not meant to be), those folks won't be missed.
I guess it just sounds like this outlook requires one to look upon WoW as a job/way of life/sole purpose in life, in which case the game's current max level is the least of your problems. To me, a guy that just really enjoys the game, it's fine.
EDIT: Also just wanted to add that it takes pretty much no time (and little effort) at all to gain levels in WoW. Compare it to the other FotM's like Aion, Lineage 2, FF...yeah sure the level cap may be smaller, but is it really less daunting when it can take days to gain a single level, and the only way to do it is to kill the same groups of mobs in an endless grinding circuit? To me that's a hell of a lot more of a put-off than a higher level cap but with plenty of ways to quickly attain it. WoW is chock-full of content and ways to bring your toon up quickly...the amount of folks that ding 80 and still don't know wtf they're doing is testament to this.
Post by
bwirum
To the op:
Consider the fact that I started playing this game at release in Europe. I spent the better part of the first year getting my first character to lvl 60. My last char I leveled from scratch (been dumped for a while now poor thing) I got to lvl 53 in about a week. Not played, a week total. Between the generally faster exp, the heirlooms (I know, new players won't see that, but hey, it's only 20%) and the reworking of the zones and quests, leveling is a breeze compared to what it used to be.
No, I don't think it's gonna be daunting at all.
Post by
xShadowbladex
Easily enough said, there are games and MMOs that have 125-250 levels. So far WoW has been the easiest and most fun game to level in and shortest span to level in. During Classic though it took easily 2x as long to hit 60 as it does 80 now. I lol at blizz's way of making it fun for teh(<~on purpose) nubs.
Edit; Lineage2 it takes a good day of playing to hit level5 if you have just begun. To hit level20 for okay players it could take you 2-3 weeks. On WoW it takes me a good day to hit level25.
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