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Leveling tank build - some questions about specc
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Post by
Sondrizzle
I just started a Death Knight and I am loving myself to death with it. But I have one problem, I started a DK because, well, Death Knights just sound and are badass and I wanted a tank, and I want to level as a tank. But I'm not sure what specc to use.
I am currently using a Blood DPS-specc because, well, I just wanted to get to level 60 in Outlands as fast as possible. Anyways. I asked a friend what specc he recommended and he said Unholy, an then I asked two different tanks in Hellfire Ramparts and the said frost and blood. So I've been recommended all three speccs as leveling tank builds.
But then I thought that I should ask the experts at Wowhead about it because you guys usually have better advice then tanks saying "specc unholy noob". So, yeah, my question is simply, what tank specc do you recommend for the best tanking while leveling? :)
Post by
sunwukung
If you only have one spec....be frost or unholy so you can aoe tank better and not have people rage at you.
Post by
apocalypsa
Frost downhands. It just has much more aoe aggro. Start with
this
at lvl 60 with a normal 2hander, dw sucks for lvling. Later on get blade barrier and anticipation. Rotation: HB>DnD>BB and repeat as long as necessary(on trash)
Post by
icetrix
I strongly advise Frost. It has major migration then Unholy. While Unholy is a very nice Tank spec, your only migration is Bone Shield wich is only good by how big your Avoidance is. I first did it and found that the healers where complaining about major damage.
This is the openers I use:
If enemies are within reach for Howling Blast =
HB, IT, PS, PEST
then
BB
. Keep your deseases up and swap between enemies and do BB to keep your Blood rune in cooldown and Frost Strike
If the enemies aren't within reach of Howling Blast =
D&D
under them but slightly towards you and
Death Grip
eventually casters towards you and Strangulate if there are more,
IT, PS
then
PEST
to spread
On Singly target it's easy =
IT, PS, BS, OB, BS
(Why not BS after eachother? because it will be much easier to keep up Blade Barrier)
When Killing Machine procs, use Howling Blast on multiple mobs and Frost Strike on single target.
Also, do healers a favor and stack Defense rating. If ya hit 72 you can enchant your weapon with Stoneskin Gargoyle, it gives 2% more stamina and 25 Defense (not rating) wich isn't too shabby at that level.
Also, read the stickies about Frost Tanking, it's about that.
Edit: No blood boils for ya on Single target
Post by
woohaa
I strongly advise Frost. It has major migration then Unholy. While Unholy is a very nice Tank spec, your only migration is Bone Shield wich is only good by how big your Avoidance is. I first did it and found that the healers where complaining about major damage.
This is the openers I use:
If enemies are within reach for Howling Blast =
HB, IT, PS, PEST
then
BB
. Keep your deseases up and swap between enemies and do BB to keep your Blood rune in cooldown and Frost Strike
If the enemies aren't within reach of Howling Blast =
D&D
under them but slightly towards you and
Death Grip
eventually casters towards you and Strangulate if there are more,
IT, PS
then
PEST
to spread
On Singly target it's easy =
IT, PS, BB, OB, BB
(Why not BB after eachother? Cuz it's much easier to keep Blade Barrier up if you do it this way, trust me)
When Killing Machine procs, use Howling Blast on multiple mobs and Frost Strike on single target.
Also, do healers a favor and stack Defense rating and don't take the BoA axe cuz you can't enchant it with Stone Gargoyle.. that Runeforge enchant really helps the damage migration.
Also, read the stickies about Frost Tanking, it's about that.
.....
okay first it's mitigation not migration. he had a few points here and there right but for the most part don't listen to this...his rotation is wrong and unholy is a horrible tanking spec. boneshield has nothing to do with your avoidance...you basically get 3 charges...and when your tanking 5 mobs...it will be gone in 2 seconds. anyway...
Go frost. make your life easier by glyphing in howling blast and Death and Decay when you hit 60. you can stay blood and don't tank till 60...once you hit 60 then go respec a frost tanking spec...2hand or dw doesn't matter. the boa axe is fine to use because STONESKIN GARGOYLE isn't available till 72.
with glyph of howling blast you can apply frost fever with your howling blast which means you don't need to IT/PS/pest. you can
Dnd/HB/BB
HB/BB/OB/BB
...very easy rotation. until you can put points into morbidity you may find DnD isn't up every pull. if it is only use it once per pull as the CD is rather long and if you use it when your mobs are about to die you won't have it for the next pull. use HoW when all your runes are on cooldown. also don't spam froststrike. you want to save runic power for runestrike. you want to macro all your normal skills with runestrike for tanking purposes...this is the macro
#showtooltip
/cast Howling blast
/cast !rune strike
runestrike is an on-next-swing ability. like heroic strike and maul except it's only available after a dodge or parry. so whenever it procs you want to use it. the "!" makes the skill not toggle off when your spamming your buttons.
your single target rotation is easy however somehow icetrix got it wrong >_> it's...
IT/PS/OB/BS/BS yes BLOOD STRIKE not Blood boil. blood boil is for aoe
OB/OB/OB
now why not BS/OB/BS? simple....your blood runes turn into deathrunes when you BS. if you BS first then OB your using 2 GCDs before the last BS and during your 2nd rotation you'll have to wait to OB and you'll end up having 4 runes cooldown all in the same GCD and you can't use them all up. the extra 1.5 sec it takes to put up bladebarrier is not a big deal trust me. any other questions either ask in this thread or check the tanking stickies.
and yes icetrix got one thing right....get str/stam/def gear.
Post by
icetrix
I strongly advise Frost. It has major migration then Unholy. While Unholy is a very nice Tank spec, your only migration is Bone Shield wich is only good by how big your Avoidance is. I first did it and found that the healers where complaining about major damage.
This is the openers I use:
If enemies are within reach for Howling Blast =
HB, IT, PS, PEST
then
BB
. Keep your deseases up and swap between enemies and do BB to keep your Blood rune in cooldown and Frost Strike
If the enemies aren't within reach of Howling Blast =
D&D
under them but slightly towards you and
Death Grip
eventually casters towards you and Strangulate if there are more,
IT, PS
then
PEST
to spread
On Singly target it's easy =
IT, PS, BB, OB, BB
(Why not BB after eachother? Cuz it's much easier to keep Blade Barrier up if you do it this way, trust me)
When Killing Machine procs, use Howling Blast on multiple mobs and Frost Strike on single target.
Also, do healers a favor and stack Defense rating and don't take the BoA axe cuz you can't enchant it with Stone Gargoyle.. that Runeforge enchant really helps the damage migration.
Also, read the stickies about Frost Tanking, it's about that.
.....
okay first it's mitigation not migration. he had a few points here and there right but for the most part don't listen to this...his rotation is wrong and unholy is a horrible tanking spec. boneshield has nothing to do with your avoidance...you basically get 3 charges...and when your tanking 5 mobs...it will be gone in 2 seconds. anyway...
Go frost. make your life easier by glyphing in howling blast and Death and Decay when you hit 60. you can stay blood and don't tank till 60...once you hit 60 then go respec a frost tanking spec...2hand or dw doesn't matter. the boa axe is fine to use because STONESKIN GARGOYLE isn't available till 72.
with glyph of howling blast you can apply frost fever with your howling blast which means you don't need to IT/PS/pest. you can
Dnd/HB/BB
HB/BB/OB/BB
...very easy rotation. until you can put points into morbidity you may find DnD isn't up every pull. if it is only use it once per pull as the CD is rather long and if you use it when your mobs are about to die you won't have it for the next pull. use HoW when all your runes are on cooldown. also don't spam froststrike. you want to save runic power for runestrike. you want to macro all your normal skills with runestrike for tanking purposes...this is the macro
#showtooltip
/cast Howling blast
/cast !rune strike
runestrike is an on-next-swing ability. like heroic strike and maul except it's only available after a dodge or parry. so whenever it procs you want to use it. the "!" makes the skill not toggle off when your spamming your buttons.
your single target rotation is easy however somehow icetrix got it wrong >_> it's...
IT/PS/OB/BS/BS yes BLOOD STRIKE not Blood boil. blood boil is for aoe
OB/OB/OB
now why not BS/OB/BS? simple....your blood runes turn into deathrunes when you BS. if you BS first then OB your using 2 GCDs before the last BS and during your 2nd rotation you'll have to wait to OB and you'll end up having 4 runes cooldown all in the same GCD and you can't use them all up. the extra 1.5 sec it takes to put up bladebarrier is not a big deal trust me. any other questions either ask in this thread or check the tanking stickies.
and yes icetrix got one thing right....get str/stam/def gear.
it's true that using Glyph of Howling is great and all but it's bad practice to get used to it. I think you have more benefit using Icy Touch, Plague Strike and Pestilence because you will use that in all specs and you don't need to relearn that part. Also with two diseases you gain more threat.
Also, doing 2 BB/BS after eachother can be done, you will hate when the Blade barrier is dropped for 1 second. This shouldn't be a problem in Lowbie dungeons but when a ICC will hit you at that time the 5% extra can be crucial. And doing a OB between or after don't make anything different.
Also in Unholy it takes 6 - 8 seconds to take it away because you can't lose a charge more then 2 seconds. You need alot of Dodge/Parry to make it nice but because it's training and you only get that much Dodge/Parry at 80, it can better get passed.
Thanks for noticing the BB btw, it should be BS.. and don't care about spelling
Post by
1909
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
drainyou
This is great information as I am very much in the same boat as the OP. Seems everyone has leveled the as x,y,z specc and loved it so simply picking thet most viable/effective tree to tank-level has been a bit difficult to get a fix on. To add to it, I've seen very few references to just what talents is suggested to take first.
Just 'around the web' I seem to see more push to be blood. Is there a reason to go frost at 60? Is there a point along the road to 80 that switching back to blood would be a good call as it does seem to be a preferred raid build right now and as we know is the designated tank build in Cata? As mentioned above ' getting used to it' early seems like a good ideaa. Again, if its a level to 80 in frost then switch then I'm for it....
Thanks in advance
Post by
apocalypsa
Nope. Blood is superior in EH and cooldowns, but thats only important for raiding. Keeping aoe threat as blood is waaay harder so just go frost EZ mode.
Post by
drainyou
See... that's a perfect answer. Though for whatever reason I'm not ciphering the ' EH ' you mentioned. I'll switch over to frost tonight and give it a whirl. I have a few questions for that but I'll look for other threads first. Thanks.
Post by
Sondrizzle
First of all, thanks for all your advices. Tanking in Outland worked perfectly, it wasn't even a problem. But I am now 69 an Utgarde Keep is seriously killing me. My health is dropping extremely fast and it seems as if I'm taking a lot of spike damage (yeah, know about no defense and that stuff, just waiting to hit level 70 to get my cobalt-gear).
Anyways, any tips regarding use of cooldowns in pulls and such?
Thanks again, the advices I've received in this thread is awesome :D
Post by
110766
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
drainyou
@Son I noticed that you're missing Toughness and Anticipation in turn for more damage based talents in Blood. It may be worth just running non WotLK dungeons and questing to 70 for the cobalt set + some more defensive talent adjustments until you get better gearz.
Just a suggestion from another DK newb.
Post by
Sondrizzle
I actually have the entire Cobalt-set, just not using it for questing since the heirloom shoulder and chest give me XP. And I have maxed out Anticipation and Toughness, but went down to Morbidity do lower the cooldown on Death and Decay but I am now working on maxing out Blade Barrier. :)
Post by
292117
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
477814
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
yeah that first dungeon in northrend (UK) is a tough obstacle to overcome. you'll get hit harder there then nexus and AN. until you have your cobalt gear keep the pulls small and any large groups pop a def CD like Icebound fort or unbreakable armor to help the healer out.
Out of every tanking class DKs take the most dmg from that instance. i've done both. Tanked and healed reg UK after the tanking nerfs and by far DKs take the most dmg. So...in order to ensure your group doesn't get upset and kick you. This is where you'll learn the basis of being a good tank. Pull groups you know you and your healer can handle and also pull efficiently so the group doesn't feel like their progression is too slow cause you can't handle larger groups.
Also
I think you have more benefit using Icy Touch, Plague Strike and Pestilence because you will use that in all specs and you don't need to relearn that part. Also with two diseases you gain more threat.
ah the infamous..."you do more threat with 2 diseases" argument. unfortunately even though you are correct in assuming that 2 diseases causes more threat. your wrong in assuming that you can cause more
AOE
threat with HB, IT, PS, PEST then BB. compared to HB/DND/BB.
Also your argument that it's better to IT/PS/pest because you use that in all specs and you won't have to relearn them is redundant. apparently if you feel that relearning a rotation is too hard. then maybe you should go play a different class...infact maybe you should quit wow completely and play a different game. Every spec for every class has a different rotation to learn. if you haven't learned that yet then maybe it's time you open your eyes to that fact. DKs aren't any different.
Post by
apocalypsa
if you like tanking you can try a spec like
this
at lvl 60 and then go deeper into Blood and take some talents in other trees. I am using
this spec
finally and it has no problems in any content.
Very true, but as blood you probably have aoe threat problems, which is why 2h frost is easier while leveling.
What is it with people starting as dumbass %^&*ting out bullcrap and then moving on to telling the truth? First Evonath and now Thomerthu.
Post by
woohaa
well i think we all have to start somewhere. not everyone wants to stay a noob. i think i posted some stupid stuff when i first started posting. i think many players post here thinking they know everything there is to know about dks then find out really quick that they don't know nearly as much as they thought they did. it's a humility thing, but you end up learning more about the class you like to play.
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