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How am I supposed to get into raids when.....
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Post by
twitch77
It is NOT possible to get 5K GS with non-frost emblem gear alone. I recently leveled to 80 as a warrior and after getting all the emblem pieces, plus crafted 264 boots I'm still in the same boat as the OP.
The only way to reach 5K GS is to raid ToC 10/25. Heck my DK that has 4 251 pieces is only 5083 GS.
My lock had a gs of 5082 without ever joining a raid, using a frost badge or high lvl (200+) BoE item, just from hc drops...never say never.
same with my hunter (think it was around 5025, but my server wanted 5200 to run icc 10 lol). . .though i did cheat a bit and get the ashen verdict friendly ring from a few trash clears (no bosses downed).
Post by
obiwaynekenobi
Nobody is saying that given the following scenario:
* One toon with a 5.3K GS
* One toon with a 4.8K GS
You should take the 4.8K one to ICC10 instead of the higher toon. What people are arguing against are the scrubs who will DEMAND a 5.3K GS in Trade, and if only the 4.8K person asked to join would deny him a spot despite him
being appropriately geared
for the content.
By all means if you have multiple people who want to go, and limited spots, you can bring the higher geared people. But, IMO of course, if you're telling a 4.8K GS person to GTFO of of your ICC10 raid, when you don't have a higher geared person
immediately available
, then you're a scrub who wants to be carried, because the 4.8K person is geared enough for ICC10.
Post by
567203
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Lorkin
But, IMO of course, if you're telling a 4.8K GS person to GTFO of of your ICC10 raid, when you don't have a higher geared person
immediately available
, then you're a scrub who wants to be carried, because the 4.8K person is geared enough for ICC10.
I clearly don't agree with this. I spam trade LFM for ICC 10 going 7/12 at least and I require a pretty high GS. 4.8k just isn't enough buffer to ensure the person can contribute enough to get past the first 2 wings. I'd love for a 4.8k GS person to prove me wrong with above 8k dps on bosses, but that just hasn't happened. If it did happen at all, I would reconsider the whole GS thing.
Right now GS has proven time and time again the person's potential. Until I get surprised, I will continue to rely on it to measure a person's raid potential.
Post by
331902
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Kelborn
Your gear will get there, keep running randoms. Just remember (something that a lot of these GS obsessed idiots don't seem to know) the best item for you might not necessarily have the highest item level.
Indeed. Oh
Mirror of Truth
, how I still love you so. Granted there are things better, but my rogue just has issues with RNG. BiS libram for Holy Pallys is still
Libram of Renewl
. While the spellpower one seem nice, 10% off my Holy Light cost is a lot more enticing. I also laugh at every DK tank with
Sigil of the Bone Gryphon
. I'll take my guarnteed 200 dodge rating from
Sigil of Insolence
any day as opposed to the chance that I'll even get the buff from Bone Gryphon to stack to 220. With Rune Strike procs reduced by 20% in ICC, I've had the buff fall off before it even stacked all the way. Biggest waste of Frost badges I've ever seen.
Post by
obiwaynekenobi
I clearly don't agree with this. I spam trade LFM for ICC 10 going 7/12 at least and I require a pretty high GS. 4.8k just isn't enough buffer to ensure the person can contribute enough to get past the first 2 wings.
And yet the GS addon itself says the base for ICC10 is
4700
. I assume it means for
all
of ICC10. Now maybe since it seems you're forming a PuG, you might want higher to compensate for the bad players, but the GS addon itself is saying that you should be looking for people with a minimum of 4700 GS.
Post by
Lorkin
If you are arguing that 4700 GS folks "can" do ICC, I'd point you to the undergeared guild that just downed Saurfang in all Blues. Sure you could do it at 4700, even at sub 4k GS in full blues, I'm not debating that.
My point is do you really want to? Do you really want to take a chance on someone that may or may not be that last 5% you need to beat an enrage timer? If I could ONLY find a group in the 4.8k to 5k GS range for an ICC 10, I would probably stop after the first wing. There's no point to go any further if your dps can't beat the enrage timers of the 2nd wing. And from what I've seen on the pugs I've been on, folks with that kind of gear have trouble with Fester and Rot.
Post by
446836
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
pezz
Personally I would take a 4.8k GS player who knows the fights over a 5.6k GS player who knows nothing and has been carried through ICC a few times, anytime.
As would anyone, but you're phrasing this, either intentionally or unintentionally, in a way that is supposed to suggest that this is common. The guy with a bunch of 264 epics? He
probably
earned them. The guy whose demonstrates that he has so far failed to enter ICC once, or only has 3/12 or something despite the 20% buff? He's
probably
terrible.
GS is not a 1.0 correlation to player skill, sure, but there's definitely a correlation.
A low GS is also not a 1.0 correlation to a terrible player, sure, but there's definitely a correlation.
Post by
567203
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
obiwaynekenobi
In the end, bad gear is
still
worse than good gear. Of course the individual player can make a difference, but we're talking about grouping with strangers, so it's not much of an argument here.
And this, I agree with 100%.
Post by
slickrick0419
GS would only be more useful than it currently is IF they calculated how well someone was gemmed and enchanted. WHGS gives you 15 pts for an enchant, doesn't have to be the right enchant, you still get 15pts.... which is also the same with gems. The GS mathematics should identify which are the proper gear types, gems and enchants for each class and spec and then give an accurate "Gear Score". Until then GS is pretty useless. IMO
Post by
USMCDiablo
It should also tell you how good a person is at mashing their rotation hotkeys. Then it'll be even more accurate, and until such time i believe that GS is pretty useless.
I stand by my idea that Raid experience and awareness are far more important than actual numbers though. If people know the fights, they're not gonna die and you can easily do the first half of ICC+free badge and maybe dream without much hassle even under geared, especially with the 20% buff that'll be 25% next week ^_^
Post by
567203
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Post by
138583
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
384477
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Post by
368348
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Post by
260150
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Lorkin
Patience has disappeared.
Kindness has disappeared.
It's all about the phat lewts and nobody gives a damn about one another.
I agree for the most part with this but you gotta understand there's a limit. I've been in great pugs where everyone knew what they had to do, the only vent chat was if some new blip on the radar shows up, and the tanks chain pulled trash while people were distributing loot.
Then I've been in PuGs that ready checks before each trash pull, explains all the boss fights for hours on end, spends countless hours distributing loot, and takes as long as 2 hours to clear the first wing.
Good group first wing clear ~ 40 mins. Bad group first wing clear +2 hours.
There's being patient and being Buddhist monk patient. Most people want to get the run over with for either their emblems or phat loot. You can't really debate that people would pick the +2 hour run vs the 40 min run.
It's a video game in the end. At lot of people PuG. There's a chance you will never group with those people again. I go the extra inch or mile for my guildies, but random pug members are like strangers. You form up to work towards a goal but at the end of it you part ways. There is no hanging out later. There is no after party. Why do people expect more than this?
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