This site makes extensive use of JavaScript.
Please enable JavaScript in your browser.
Live
PTR
10.2.7
PTR
10.2.6
Beta
BM is not dead
Post Reply
Return to board index
Post by
Bahzell
Ok, here's an example. You pick up the New York Times, on the front page says *Stock Exchange Collapse*. Now, you think to yourself hmmmmm, I wonder if this is the only place where I'm going to see this today? We're on the INTERNET my friend, where one can read many different things, in many different forms, and many different places. Do you know how many websites there are related to World of Warcraft alone? A lot( Fyi read the bit in question on Mmo-Champ). I avoid Elitist Jerks itself solely because Im terrible at math, and that website is full enough of it to make my brain explode.
Im glad for you that you enjoy doing the top dps you can, that's
fun
for you right? Well, how bout this, many other people think its fun to raid, without the conformity that is wow nowadays( Be one spec, or you fail essentially). Hell, I see mages raid as fire, simply because they enjoy it.
As to if I can dps like Kripp, doubtful, but I can hold my own, damn proud of the dps I can pull in game. And yes, it is mostly just mashing buttons mindlessly, and moving from fire, aside from that, not much else to it. I'm a full blown casual, that pretty much pugs everything when I can, but for the sole reason that working 12 hour days doesnt allow me to fit into a normal progression schedule.
That being said, in no way shape or form would I assume you are a noob, from your previous posts on here you seem to be quite familiar with the mechanics of your class, so why instead of constructive feedback, do we laugh at these other people that come to wowhead in search of real assistance? Seems to me there's an ungodly number of *Huntards*( Shudder, I hate that term) playing this game nowadays, I say were better off educating them, instead of calling them down.
Wall of text crits for over 9k=P.. yet again, man Im a verbose Mf'er
In any case, I think we all have a bit we can learn from each other, unfortunately we cant all type in here as a conversation without having to reload pages repeatedly. I'll be the first to say I look forward to what Cataclysm brings us(oh noes focus)=)
Will provide an armory link if youre at all interested in what a scrubcasual looks like=P
Post by
bantay
now your saying in a casual player point of view and kripp is talking in a raiding scenario. many reply in this thread have agreed to what kripp is saying and adding some things that the OP will expect if he joined a raid as BM. its not nice to bash someone when he's in a different plane as yours. im in the same way as you before, thinking just being aware of your environment(not dieing) as well as mashing the buttons can make your dps that high. its also the little things that you neglect that can add up to your dps. i guess you know that too.
and if you have replied on post in the way you do now my reply would be different too. and i dont laugh at people who's asking for a help/questions about their class. i only give in return what other people deseve they would get. i made the mistake once too and to see that i made a mistake, i reply in a manly manner that i made one.
Post by
Bahzell
Whats the difference between a raid that a casual does and a raid that someone does in a guild? nothing, except the 9/24 other people are those whom you raid with on a regular basis. My main point is that coming across as an elitist ass aren't going to help anyone.
Just because someone is "the best" at what they do doesnt mean they too dont have room for improvement. We all can learn a new trick, or a new way to do something, that will help us out. I for one just dont appreciate the condescending tone that many posters on here come rolling in with.
If someone says to me lol you'rebad, Im going to ask for proof, simple as that. Just because BM may not be the
best
, doesnt mean it's not viable, just means that guy doing 9k dps covers for a lil bit of the lesser dps the Bm hunter is doing. When I do 7k dps in a raid, and see another hunter do 3.7k, my first thought it always, what is he doing that I can maybe help him with? Not lol *!@# youre bm you just suck. That to me is the bane of wow, however, when I see someone gemming Strength, or mp5, its a straight out LOL, because that is probably the simplest task regarding someones character( Hint, our tier gear carries the stats we desire). But again, it's not so obvious to some, so we must coach them, mold them into pretty little shooting machines, and maybe, just maybe one day we can rid ourselves of the huntard moniker, and all live happily ever after ^^.
In regards to Kripp, I realize he may be the top hunter in the world,wow-parse-ing(spelling) wise, but does that really entitle someone to a verbal bashing? After all, not like the guy can jump on one of our fellow posters machines and teach him how to play his class. Thats why these forums are here, but seems to be so much negativity accompanying it.
I dunno, maybe Im just old fashioned, maybe I belong in the stone age, but has the anonymity of our online gaming community really come down to who can make shinier numbers on our computer screen? Is that really whats fun? Making people feel small and useless because their purples arent as purple as someone elses? I truly, without a doubt hope not.
Post by
bantay
There's a big difference in being a casual and a raiding player. Have you seen other post here that says kick him or the BM hunter? It might even be forgiving if your in a guild because you know the people there and all not complain about your dps but not in a pug.
I might have not seen it but I don't see kripp bash the OP as the way you bash kripp. I thank that guy for through his videos I learned and increased my dps as a MM. Sometimes learn to take any constructive critisism.
Post by
Bahzell
Im not by any means bashing Kripp, the man is a nightmare for Omen ^^. Im angered by the tone he used when he first said you would not be coming to my raid if youre bm. Since when does dps truly matter except in hard mode content? or bosses with enrage timers, and that's my whole point, the entire point of a 10/25 man raid, is to work together to kill a raid boss. If the boss dies, who cba to care how? If for whatever reason, everyone needs to do 9k+ dps to kill any raid boss in game that isnt a hard mode, Id eat my shoe. And yes, in any raid I pug, the gamut of dps runs from 2k, to anywhere over 10k, you cant tell tell me the boss dies any different, albeit any faster, with that sort of mixture?
The one thing i will note about Kripp's videos is that he somehow manages to (almost)always avoid incoming damage, one video I watched of a ToC raid I was quite impressed, I dont know if hes got an uber computer, or is in a real tight environment to reduce lag etc. I wish I could avoid a lot of that stuff, but my machine loves dipping under 5fps in 25 mans.
To end this, I have the utmost respect for a guy that truly reaches the calculated "peak" of our classes dps(peak as is calculated by ej). But I refuse to sit by and have someone be told they wont be allowed a spot in a raid because of a spec they prefer to play.
Constructive criticism or not, the guy stated he is proud to be BM spec, he didnt however, ask what he can do to improve his chances of staying in a raid, and imo, it neednt have to go so far as a complete overhaul of the way he's learned to play his toon.
Ima go smoke now, I eagerly await your reply.
Post by
Masonic
Hey guys, it's only a bloody game designed for "FUN". You can bet most of the real 'elitist's' in WoW are in fact 'EPIC FAILS' in real life !.
Post by
537112
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
537112
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Manatapit
To be honest, i didnt see anything bad about Kripp's post. The guy obviously knows what he wants and doesnt want in his raids. If he doesnt want a BM Hunter in his raid i dont think he's a bad guy for doing so. I believe all hunters should know by now that BM hunters bring almost nothing to a raid besides a big red pet and mediocre dps. Any raid utility you think a BM hunter brings to a raid can be brought by a different class which can usually bring their utility + good dps. With that being said, the only thing left to bring by a BM hunter is DPS, which can we done better by a MM or SV hunter.
Post by
bantay
Im not by any means bashing Kripp, the man is a nightmare for Omen ^^. Im angered by the tone he used when he first said you would not be coming to my raid if youre bm. Since when does dps truly matter except in hard mode content? or bosses with enrage timers, and that's my whole point, the entire point of a 10/25 man raid, is to work together to kill a raid boss. If the boss dies, who cba to care how? If for whatever reason, everyone needs to do 9k+ dps to kill any raid boss in game that isnt a hard mode, Id eat my shoe. And yes, in any raid I pug, the gamut of dps runs from 2k, to anywhere over 10k, you cant tell tell me the boss dies any different, albeit any faster, with that sort of mixture?
The one thing i will note about Kripp's videos is that he somehow manages to (almost)always avoid incoming damage, one video I watched of a ToC raid I was quite impressed, I dont know if hes got an uber computer, or is in a real tight environment to reduce lag etc. I wish I could avoid a lot of that stuff, but my machine loves dipping under 5fps in 25 mans.
To end this, I have the utmost respect for a guy that truly reaches the calculated "peak" of our classes dps(peak as is calculated by ej). But I refuse to sit by and have someone be told they wont be allowed a spot in a raid because of a spec they prefer to play.
Constructive criticism or not, the guy stated he is proud to be BM spec, he didnt however, ask what he can do to improve his chances of staying in a raid, and imo, it neednt have to go so far as a complete overhaul of the way he's learned to play his toon.
Ima go smoke now, I eagerly await your reply.
actually from what your saying in you posts here i think thats bashing... and sorry for the late reply, i have to wake up early to hear mass.
as i said, your point of view on raid is different from where kripp is coming from. and yes he have a great computer since he's raiding in 1920X1080 resolution. cant download his UI because of that. we are in the same boat in ms/fps situation. i raid in 300+ms and 8-12fps so sometimes i raid in slow motion lol. but i maintain to be in top 5 of the chart and sometime on top. i dont see anything wrong if he said he wont invite you in any of his raid if your BM and some people here will agree with me. why havent you said anything about other reply here that imply the same sentiments? because i wont invite a BM hunter that i dont know in my raid too. not if your my friend lol.
Post by
146856
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
268272
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
338900
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
450468
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
207272
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
314353
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
138583
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Eleazer
After reading this entire way too long thread, there are a few things that need to be clarified to keep from being stated again due to misinformation and a lack of understanding of raids. I will attempt to state them in a clear and concise manner to keep a majority of you from becoming lost.
1. Elitistjerks.com in no way supports BM hunters in raids. The poster who stated that EJ's says it Can be a top dps took one quote completely out of context and hung his coat on it. Let's make this clear, BM hunters can be as good as a lower geared or poorly played MM or SV hunter, and for brief bursts of damage than can legitimately be at the top. It's the period between cooldowns that hurt them severely.
2. BM hunters are valuable additions to raids if you don't raid with a ret paladin or arcane mage who provides the same 3 percent damage increase buff. If you do than there is no point in bringing the BM hunter, because any other class will put out more dps if
competently
played.
3. The funniest part of this entire debate is the OP's claim that we should let him raid like he wants because it's his money. Well I have 24 or 9 other people who are spending money as well, and it's entirely their right to say go spend your money doing something else. As a guild leader and a raid leader, the masses outweigh the opinion of one guy who wants to run as a BM. I might be able to fit you in with an overgeared group, but if i can find a competent dps who provides a buff or more dps than you will find your way out. Look you could spec 71 in one talent tree, and run around screaming about not getting into raids and make the same amount of sense.
4. BM hunters are like Frost DK's- you take them for the buff they provide not for the dps they bring, however if we get a ret paladin (BM hunter) or an enhance shaman than those two specs I will ask to switch to a more viable dps option to maximise the amount of dps done, and to limit the amount of time I have to spend on a boss. The dps difference between a well played MM/Survival hunter and a well-played BM hunter is around 1k dps. - Elitistjerks does state this very clearly in several of their posts.
5. I do play a BM hunter, I enjoy him, but do not raid with him. I use him to go achievement hunting and questing when I feel like doing nothing for awhile, and it's fun just scaring the snot out of tanks with the giant Devilsaur ;p. Because I know that the BM hunter will be a dps loss, I raid on my other characters (feral druid, resto shaman). I do this because while I enjoy my time with my hunter. I don't feel it is my right to inconvenience everyone else just to do things my way or to prove a point.
There is a reason no one raids as a frost mage the dps is severely lacking compared to other specs. I lead a 120 man Casual raiding guild. We spend all week goofing off on alts and playing around with convoluted specs. We have mages who spend the week as frost mages, I goof off on my BM hunter pugging into raids and scaring the snot out of tanks with my giant Devilsaur (so much fun) Rogues as subtelty, I could go on and on. When Friday and Saturday come around and it's time for progression raiding all that crap goes away, and we maximize our makeup in order to make the raid as fun and quick as possible, I don't like playing any other hunter spec so I heal on my shaman (it's a lot of fun, and he is better geared than my hunter). It's not fun wiping and it's not fun pushing out 7-9k dps and seeing some hunter doing 5k dps and saying Yeah but I am having fun. It's the same as bringing a guy with blue gems or who didn't want to "spend gold" on enchants. That's great that you want to play that way, but don't complain if I don't want to play that way with you.
Post by
481452
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
141898
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post Reply
You are not logged in. Please
log in
to post a reply or
register
if you don't already have an account.