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How to Druid: Moonkin PvE 101 (WotLK)
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Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hashmel
i'll have to look into the topic of owlkin frenzy
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
well hot damn this one slipped by me
Patch 3.1.0
(2009-04-14):
Is now properly considered an Enrage effect. Now also does not trigger from spell hits, only physical ranged and melee attacks.
*Change reverted - Owlkin Frenzy still procs off of any damage type, including spell/AoE.
seems they did a stealth removal of the nerf in a hotfix, not sure when that was, but
Owlkin Frenzy
can proc off all manner of damage taken and has no ICD
druid base mana is 3496, 2% of that is 69, 69 mana every 2 secs OF is up = 345 mana per proc, isn't much by itself but that's about the same as the mana return from a crit with 17k+ mana and combined with wisd/mana spring, innervate, crit returns, and replenishment and mana shouldn't be an issue
while its uptime is anything but 100% in a raid environment if your mana isn't an issue the talent choices to invest your last 4-5 talent points aren't all that impressive
Brambles
buffs a 3 min cd and the thorns on the tank/s will be a bit stronger but the dps gain is negligable
Gale Winds
is a noticable dps boost but only in aoe situations and in most circumstances doesn't benefit boss fights
Improved Insect Swarm
isn't a significant dps boost, 3% dmaage boost to an ability that accounts for maybe 30% of your dps is only a 0.9% dps boost
generally these provide such a small boost to boss dps that you could simply not spend your last 4-5 talents at all and probably not even notice
Owlkin Frenzy
is a moderate chance to increase all your damage by 10%, regain a small amount of mana, and become immune to pushback for a duration and can proc off even the silliest of things
)bosses with aoe, random application of dots, "fire" that can be ran through for a small amount of damage without fear of dying, insignificant adds, or a damaging aura can all proc this which when it's not active is about the same as an almost unnoticeable boost such as from above talents and while active is a very noticeable 10% boost to dps and some mana regen for the duration)
with that in mind i'm wondering if replacing check #3 would be ideal
3. if you need more mana regen invest in dreamstate as needed
to something along the lines of
after covering both a knockback and mana regen, as needed, invest 2-3 points in owlkin frenzy
looking for feedback on the subject
BOOMKIN
53/0/11+5
is the basic blueprint for a good boomkin
if you need typhoon for soloing, occasional pvp, certain fights (gluth), or just in case put one of the spare points into it
if you need mana regen invest in intensity as needed
if you need more mana regen invest in dreamstate as needed
if you need more aoe dps invest in gale winds
if you have nothing left to invest in put the leftovers in imp IS or brambles for a slight single target dps boost
Glyphs
Moonfire
is a must for pve as you'll always have at least 1 target and it's easily the best single target dps boost
Focus:
both an aoe and single target glyph, makes SF safer to use if you've yet to get the hang of the range and also increases the damage
Starfall:
both an aoe and single target glyph, reduces the cd by 1/3
Insect Swarm:
sacrifices the 3% miss debuff in favor of 30% more IS damage
Starfire:
less time spent refreshing MF meaning more time spent melting face
Innervate:
if you have no mana your dps will drop to zero, good for beginning boomkins with mana issues
If you've specced Typhoon it's for a useful knockback or @#$%ing off the tank, in an aoe situation another Hurricane is a much better call and glyphing out of the knockback ruins any attempt to annoy the tank making glyph of Typhoon a poor choice for either reason
Post by
Celdhyrean
anyone second the idea that owlkin frenzy should be placed in the priority checklist between 1 and 2 as it gives both a dps and mana regen boostI don't. The big problem with OF has always been the low proc rate, 15% for 3 talent points. If you take damage every 10s, then you'll only see 1 proc per minute. The damage and mana regen boost under such circumstances are terrible.
The comment you quoted also says "direct attacks" and doesn't mention Leeching Swarm nor the permanent aoe aura from Twins which would be the only ideal damage sources in all of ToC.
What this boils down too is that even if you take some direct damage in most ToC fights, it's never prevalent enough to put 3 points in a talent that will proc maybe once or twice per fight in most situations. And that's why, in terms of single target dps increases, OF is far behind iIS and even somewhat behind Brambles i'd say.
To answer the enumeration directly :
1° Beasts : how often do you get hit by a Snobold on that fight ? I'm at about 0% myself, they seem to shy away from druids in forms and we are separated so that i don't get hit by other peoples snobolds. Fire can work, but you'd get hit 3 times at the absolute maximum, not even garanteeing one proc (unless the dot helps too, so you might see one).
Worms : if you are targetted by a poison or fire spray, but there again if you position the raid well your chance to be the target is low.
Icehowl : 1 crash every 30s or so
2° Jarraxus : chain lightning, legion fire or the stray mistress hit or infernal aura tick if you are slow at moving. Legion might target you once or none at all, chain lighting will hit you maybe 2 or 3 times, and moving out of infernals auras should be a priority
4° Twins : you are supposed to avoid the opposite color balls, which only leaves vortex, which should happen at most twice during the fight.
5° Anub : p2 scarabs, should never hit you
Another thing to consider, OF isn't regenerating 10% of your total mana, it's regenerating 10% of your base mana. That's around 350 mana per proc.
Regarding the aoe debate, as always it's a matter of what encounters you are targetting. Gale Winds isn't needed at all in ToC unless you are doing Anub 25 hard mode in which case it becomes an absolute requirement. The question then becomes what you consider an aggressive build to be, ie only being aggressive towards regen mana and single target dps or tailoring it for the hardest current encounter ?
(and btw, moonkin aoe isn't as horrible as some people tend to say, especially if you are being good at NGing it, plus the OoC mecanic allowing us to cast them for free with a relatively high chance for good sustainability).
Regarding Moonglow, the fact that it was often taken had more to do with opportunity cost (since the only other sensible choice, iMF, was one of the lowest dps talent we had before 2T9 and the idol) than the fact that it was better than Intensity or Dreamstate.
Post by
260787
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
curlymon
Hell the original Moonkin Guide by Celd can be placed inside of a single post despite its size. No, or at least it couldn't when i wrote it. (which caused me a number of problems when i tried to add stuff afterwards as i had packed the posts a bit too near the limits, so as an advice for people wrriting guides, stay away from the limits so that you don't have to rearrange full sections afterwards)
At the time I was looking at it (right before Premium came out) It would fit with about 1k characters to spare which, considering the size and variabilty of the content, is not enough extra room. My point I was trying to make is that with 15k (?) character limits per post (for a non premium user) it makes no sense to have 11 sequential posts (165k characters total). A lot of the topics should be combined with similar topics as I have mentioned twice now in previous posts.
edit:
just checked and I must have been thinking of what could fit with premium level. I have your old guide at ~43k characters long including formatting and coding.
Gemming:
My napkin math states that as long as the socket bonus is 3SP or more per yellow gem socket in the gear and/or 8SP or more per blue socket it is worth gemming for the socket bonus. (Once past the 2 blues needed for meta and using epic gems)
red/yellow or yellow - must have a minimum of 3SP on the socket bonus
yellow/yellow - must have a minimum of 6SP on the socket bonus
red/blue or blue- must have a minimum of 8SP on the socket bonus (do not overlook due to the meta req's though)
yellow/blue - must have a minimum of 11SP on the socket bonus (do not overlook due to the meta req's)
blue/blue - must have a minimum of 16SP ont he socket bonus (do not overlook due to the meta req's)
As for Snobolds I have had a few land on me but not nearly as much as any other member of my raid... Always though it was just funny how RNG turns out at times but it seems like it might be something more then that.
Post by
Gemily
I've never been hit while on my druid. Odd.
Post by
hashmel
in regards to the changes to
Black magic
"This enchantment now sometimes increases haste rating for the caster rather than inflicting the caster's target with a damage-over-time effect. It is now triggered by landing any harmful spell rather than inflicting damage with a spell."
pre-3.3
1045 to 1155 shadow damage over 15 seconds, 209 to 231 every 3 seconds
to the 3.3 version
250 haste for 10 seconds, 45 second ICD
how would this effect current boomkin weapon enchant choices?
Post by
Celdhyrean
Black Magic isn't good enough especially since we'll have to be haste capped without it. On average, it's less haste than 63sp, so quite obviously weak.
Post by
404185
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
curlymon
I've definately had one on my back as boomkin... But I think it was hard mode and I was one of the last dps up at the time...
Post by
Celdhyrean
You can drop the lines about WiseEclipse now :/ It's going to be nerfed in 3.3.
Post by
murakaz
You can drop the lines about WiseEclipse now :/ It's going to be nerfed in 3.3.
Well, this really shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, considering the fix to rogues using Poison Swapper, though I do wish they would've given us some compensation like what the rogues got. Same with the nerf to the 2-piece tier 8, it's consistent with what they've been doing this patch to other classes, and at least they are buffing the 4-piece tier 10 bonus to make it more enticing... though the 2-piece tier 10 bonus is still pretty lame.
Post by
404185
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
murakaz
I have updated the Gear and Stats section to briefly include the changes to t8 and eclipse. As soon as anyone has any info regarding the t10 set bonusses in relation to the t9 ones would they please post so I can update accordingly. ty.
Since T9 and T10 use different emblems as currency (and now that Triumphs drop from everything), newbies should be going for at least the T9 helm and chest while saving their Emblems of Frost for 2 pieces of T10 in the remaining slots. I wouldn't recommend a specific 2 pieces to grab, since 2 of the 3 have hit (gloves and pants) which can easily sway their value... also it isn't clear what the best "off-set piece" is, so if hit doesn't decide for you, upgrade your weaker slots.
For those of us sitting in 4 pieces of T9 at the moment, while the T10 2-piece bonus isn't anything fantastic, the 4-piece T9 bonus isn't that much better, and T10's itemization makes up for the discrepancy (unless you somehow have 4 pieces of the level 258 T9).
As for going from 2 pieces of T9 to all 4 pieces of T10, well, it's a no-brainer. Not only is the itemization better (less so if you're upgrading the helm and chest) but the bonus is actually stronger than the 2pT9.
It's been awhile since the "whether or not to upgrade" decision was this easy.
Post by
curlymon
For the gearing section as it pertains to moving from T9 set bonuses to T10:
If you have 4pT9 245
* upgrade to 2pT9 245 + 2pT10 251 (keeping T9 head and chest)
* upgrade to 4pT10 251
If you have 2pT9 258 (should be head and chest) and 2pT9 245
* upgrade to 2pT9 258 + 2pT10 251 (keeping T9 head and chest)
* upgrade to 2pT9 258 + 2pT10 264 (keeping T9 head and chest)
* upgrade to 4pT10 264
If you have 4pT9 258
* upgrade to 2pT9 258 + 2pT10 264 (keeping T9 head and chest)
* upgrade to 4pT10 264
Reference
The bottom 2 of the 3 options will probably not be directly useful to moonkins reading this thread.
I also believe that this is with the belief that the boomkin was running Head, Chest, Gloves and Shoulders with Legs going off set, as that is optimal and that is what EJ posters assume.
You might also make it clear that the 4t9 set bonus is still a strong set to work towards for non end game boomkins.
Edit: That available stat allocation when moving from T9.232 to T10.251 is more then worth it and should be followed exactly the same as the first option.
Post by
340332
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
67244
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
curlymon
1-2 points in OkF is beginning to become worthwhile for later bosses in ICC. Depending on how you want to direct the content of this guide and who you feel its readership really is, you might wish to include this information Les. :P
Also the Wise Eclipse section is way out of date since you can no longer cancel aura to force an eclipse proc.
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