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Enchanting "I'm the enchanter, it all belongs to ME."
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Post by
177591
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282913
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Post by
bdeboare
Same with alchemy. If you ask someone to make a flask with their mats and they proc an extra elixir you are not entitled to the extra. If they use your mats then the alchemist is not entitled to the extra.
I disagree with this, and my opinion could be a little biased because I'm an Alchemist. According to me, you picked the specialization and had to do the quest for it because you wanted it. A profession is supposed to be a money maker. This is the reason why, if I can I just transmute outside party when I have the materials and when I get lucky, I gain another transmute.
Don't make it go that far that when people ask for a transmute they'll only want it to be done by Transmutation Masters and have them always give up both.
You get what you paid for in my opinion; which is 1 transmute.
EDIT:
Everyone expects the Enchanter to share his shards because he gained them off loot which (in PUGs atleast) he asks for. It's the nature of the profession that really is badly designed here in my opinion.
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282913
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Post by
whichwitch
Personally, when I'm in groups for instances, if I mine something and a blue gem drops, I'll ask the group if they want to roll on the gem. 9/10 times, they'll say no, but I like having the offer there. If I'm on my herb/skinner, and a Frost Lotus or an Arctic Fur drops, I'll do the same.
Do I have to? No. But I do it out of courtesy to the Enchanter who's usually in the group being used as a D/E machine. I'd like them to have a shot at something not from their profession, which I only got from being part of the group in the first place, like the shards they're providing from the D/Es.
I personally like the idea of the Enchanter not having to remember how many shards there were to be rolled on, but I do not like the fact that their choice of offering their D/E skill is being taken away.
Post by
sutasafaia
I don't think I've ever had a huge problem outside of a single person where the group enchanter is being greedy. If somebody in the group needs an item now, they roll need...if not roll greed. If the enchanter wins an item, they DE it. If he feels like being nice, he DE's other peoples items. I've only grouped with one single enchanter who demanded he get every item not need-rolled and he was kicked from the group immediately. Most of the time the greedy ones make themselves known before the instance even starts and I can kick them in advance :P
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282913
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Post by
sutasafaia
On a more serious point, I can't understand your point on the new DE option.
In the hopes that you don't understand the issues involved and actually do want to know what the point is, allow me to attempt to explain.
Currently: In the normal PUG run you have 3 mini-bosses and a final boss for a total of 4 BOP blue items. You also have a group of 5 individuals. Usually two of the four items will be Need'd by one of the team, with the other two not being wanted. In the normal group, everyone will pass on the BOP items unless they Need them so that will average two blue items that are up for grabs. If I am the only enchanter in the group, I will be the only one using Greed on the two items. That gives me a high probability of getting a much needed mat I can then use for skilling on my enchanting.
Proposed: In the Blizzard proposed change we now have all 5 people using Greed on those two items that were not Need'd. That reduces my odds of claiming 1-2 blue items for my enchanting needs to where the odds are now 1:5 on each of the two items. I now have a less than 50% chance of getting a single Blue item for the run.
Currently I have a better than 100% chance of getting at least one much needed enchanting mat that can not be gained from DE of normal BOE greens. In the proposed method I have a better than 50% chance of not getting any of the items. And other than running instances, I have very few options on how to "farm" enchanting mats of certain types.
If the proposed change happens I will switch my two enchanter toons (holy priest and mage) to run solo quests and do no instancing with them. I will focus exclusively on rep grinding and buy/DE rep gear for my required enchanting mats. Or I will grind for mats which my crafting toons will then use to create epic gear for the sole purpose to DE. However the latter method (crafting of epics) usually requires a huge investment in mats and will probably not be used.
As an example my tailor (which is my holy priest and primary enchanter) recently made an epic robe for him to wear. It required a total of 20-25 hours of farming to obtain all of the mats to make that single robe! While if I only rep grind, I can buy as many epic gear items as desired when I achieve a high enough reputation with that faction.
So as I stated earlier. If/when Blizzard implements this change to group DE of instance loot, I will stop spending my time running instances with my two enchanters and will exclusvely use them to do solo questing. Running one instance for 1-2 blue items versus 2-3 instances to get a single blue item, it really is that simple. Foolish for me, good for the non-enchanters. Fine, the non-enchanters can continue to moan about my not healing for them and I'll continue working on my professional skills.
Now do you understand my point on this issue? Yes, you get some free enchanting mats. I lose my only real method for "farming" of mats for my profession. You win, I lose.
I hate to tell you this but you've been in some generous groups. In any groups I've been in if nobody needs the BoP blues everybody rolls greed for them. The fact you had groups willing to give you the blues for mats isn't the norm, it's the exception. Most players are not nearly as generous.
Post by
282913
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Post by
sutasafaia
I hate to tell you this but you've been in some generous groups. In any groups I've been in if nobody needs the BoP blues everybody rolls greed for them. The fact you had groups willing to give you the blues for mats isn't the norm, it's the exception. Most players are not nearly as generous.
Perhaps you don't do as I do? Prior to the run starting I help the group sort out who has what professions. As part of that I explain that I will be Greed on blues that nobody Needs. And if anyone wants, I'll be more than happy to provide enchanting (or DE) services for anyone who wishes. But that I request Blue items that nobody Needs. Furthermore I usually Pass on any greens that I can not obviously use.
Since I tend to do a good job in my role and since I work with people rather than hijacking things, usually people will go along with my request. When they don't, I shrug and don't get upset.
Now see, that's an entirely different scenario after you actually explain it. Your still getting lucky though, the fact that the pugs even allow you a chance to try and organize anything is getting more and more uncommon (or maybe I'm just unlucky). Most of the time in groups I run I would refuse to just give blues to an enchanter for nothing, but then most of the time I tend to bump into jackasses that have the "all is mine" mentality. You I wouldn't mind giving blues to :P
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