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Garrosh fans?
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Post by
469682
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Gammosh
I've recently started reading books on the crusades and crusader states. The crusaders who stayed in the crusader states after the crusades learned to live with their muslim neighbours. They adapted to the realities of the region. This coupled with the fact that the Muslim were divided meant that despite being surrounded and undermanned the crusader states could survive.
Western knights, who dropped by every now and then to save their souls, however were fanatically anti-muslim and just wanted to charge in and kill (Deus vult! God wills it). This coupled with the Muslims becoming (forcefully) united under Saladin meant that the crusader forces smashed themselves to pieces and that the crusader states basically bled themselves to death.
Under Thrall and Sylvanas the Horde is practical: you can hate the Alliance all you like, we can't destroy them (even if we wanted to) and there are bigger problems. If there is a war between the Horde and the Alliance it's a cold war (with a few hot spots).
Garrosh however had the 'Deus vult!' attitude and just wants to attack the alliance, not only risking the destruction of the Horde but also weakening the forces of Azeroth against the many external threats.
This may be the World of
War
craft, but that doesn't mean that the war should be between the Horde and the Alliance. The war could be, and IMO is, between the forces of Azeroth and the outside threats like the scourge. The Horde and Alliance are forced to work together just to survive. Just like the crusader states and muslim would have to work together if the scourge had invaded the middle east during the eleventh and twelfth centuries.
Thrall for Warchief! Garrosh for leading the daylight charge across the minefield (It's a surprise attack; they'll never expect it.)
Crusaders and Muslims against the Black Death..
Crusaders: What is this?
Town Guard: These are the German rats we ordered, dont worry theyve already been distributed anongst the villagers..
Crusader: Oh no, we're too late.. These people may look fine now, but its only a matter of time before they become...dead.
Anyway I too am into the Crusades, and that was a seemless connection you made between the two.
Post by
taurenmoo812
World of Warcraft can still have war in it; it just needs to be directed at a more practical target. Killing ourselves while a physical apocalypse waltz across the planet is not practical.
I agree with this totally, and the rest of what you said.
This is the reason why I would side with Thrall and Jaina, and be oppose to Varian and Garrosh. Deathwing, despite having gone insane a long time ago, is clever enough to know letting the one threat that would stand against him, the forces of both horde and alliance, just letting them kill each other before making his move, is a far greater chance of victory over all.
Remembering how it begun in icecrown after the wrath gate, with Varian and Garrosh pushing for bloodshed between both sides, those outside the horde and alliance saw this would do nothing but make the lich king stronger, in each horde or alliance soldier that died he would be added to the lich kings army. And so Tirion Fordring created the argent touranment as a means to try and bring them together, if just to wage bouts between eachother rather that out and out killing.
Lets hope in cataclysm some outside forces will do the same and make the war betwen horde and alliance seem less important then actully killing deathwing and ragny.
Post by
HiVolt
This
is why the war is necessary.
Comparing this conflict to the Crusades is unfounded. The two situations are drastically different in nature and purpose. The Crusades were spawned out of religious fervor, and nothing else. This war has many factors at play, none of which include zealotry for any religion.
We can't say with certainty that Garrosh will lead the Horde like Robert de Sable, or Richard the Lionhearted, or any other Crusader commander of the time, because we don't know exactly how he will lead. For all we know, he could become a much more controlled and reserved leader by the time he has to take up the mantle of Warchief.
I'm not saying he will, I'm just saying we don't know.
Post by
CircusofValues
I don't want to press any buttons here, I would just like a little bit of clarity.
By this reasoning, you're saying that people should wait until Garrosh gets a little more development as a character before not-liking him, correct?
Doesn't this work both ways? Shouldn't you wait to see a little more development in his character before saying that you
do
like him?
Does a man need a reason to like a character, be it in game, book or movie?
Though it could be interpreted as that, it could be looked at it this way;
Let's imagine Hitler before his rise to power. An aspiring, young student of the arts, who just wants to get into a good school.
Now, let's say that I like him, but "insert name here" does not.
Now, let's assume for the purpose of this that history branches into two seperate realities here.
1. History plays out as it did, and he becomes a dictator. Then, "insert name here's" hate is justified, and I in turn come to hate him.
OR
2. He becomes an ambassador to the world, saving kittens, people, AND the whales, too. Does this mean that "insert name here" can still dislike him? Sure. But it damn well confirms my love for a person.
All I meant by that was that people are jumping the gun in assuming that Garrosh is going to bring the downfall of the Horde.
Post by
HiVolt
All I meant by that was that people are jumping the gun in assuming that Garrosh is going to bring the downfall of the Horde.
I understand your reasoning, but people are also jumping the gun by saying that Garrosh
won't
bring the downfall of the Horde. Speculation is still speculation no matter the circumstance. None of us have foresight into what Blizzard has planned, so none of us can rightly say what Garrosh will do with his leadership.
Those who believe that he will bring the downfall of the Horde are just as much entitled to state their opinion on the matter, as those who don't believe the same.
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