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Post by
oneforthemoney
Just realized we never saw the Mok'Nathal clan yet in Warlords. But we have seen Rexxar, so they must exist in some capacity.
Post by
Rankkor
Just realized we never saw the Mok'Nathal clan yet in Warlords. But we have seen Rexxar, so they must exist in some capacity.
Another notch mark of things I kept my hopes up for in the expansion that wasn't delivered on in the end. It is a huge gap of fridge logic that Rexxar is around but the Mok'Nathal village isn't around anywhere in Gorgrond or Frostfire.
Oddly enough, despite being a hardcore horde fan, my biggest number 1 disappointment in the expansion is not being allowed in any of the major draenei cities. We never get inside Karabor (despite being originally announced as THE CAPITAL) we never get inside Shattrath, and we only get inside an incredibly tiny section of auchindoun rather than the massive building.
Draenei architecture had been up to this point nothing more than shambles held together by wire and ductape, and this was our first chance to see pristine draenei architecture....... and we're never even allowed inside. SO not cool.
Post by
oneforthemoney
Would have been nice to finally have our own faction capitals again, rather than just sharing it with the Horde. We kind of had that with Mists, but that was a single building rather than unique city.
They might have planned for it to be in the zone that never was.
On a related topic, we are about eight months into the expansion, and it is over. Eight months! We haven't even been killing stuff in Warlord's for a year and we're done with patch content. I really hope they put in some smaller ones to add some additional things to the game. Maybe not raid worthy stuff, but something. Otherwise we're going to have a long wait of little to hope for but the eventual release of the movie.
Post by
Rankkor
Would have been nice to finally have our own faction capitals again, rather than just sharing it with the Horde. We kind of had that with Mists, but that was a single building rather than unique city.
Not even that. True, we had two buildings, but they were exact replicas of one another, the only difference was the NPC allocation. In that regard, we still got exactly 1 capital to share with the other faction, even if they were physically separated.
Here's another issue I had with our so-called "capitals" in WoD. They weren't centralized. Think about every single other expansion, where were the capitals located?
TBC: Terrokar Forest, a zone right in the middle of Draenor. We had Nagrand to the west, Shadowmoon to the east, Zangarmarsh and Blade's Edge to the north, Hellfire and Netherstorm to the North-East.
WOTLK: Cristalsong Forest. Right in the middle of Northrend. Icecrown and Storm Peaks to the North, Winterspring to the West, Zul'drak to the East, Dragonblight to the South, Borean Tundra to the South-West, Grizzly Hills and Howling Fjord to the South-East.
Cataclysm: Orgrimmar and stormwind. True, they weren't in the middle of anything, but there was the earthshrines in each capital, with portals to every new zone. So the central hub of the expansion still was located in the middle of all the action, and from there you could go to all the zones.
MoP: Vale of Eternal Blossoms, once more in the middle of pandaria, with each zone surrounding it, Kun-lai to the north, Towlong and Dread Wastes to the East, Jade forest to the west, and Valley of Four winds to the south along with Krasarang.
Where exactly is the capital in Draenor? Why, in an island in the middle of nowhere of course. As far from every single zone as it can be. Its only mildly convenient for the alliance, since the island is close to shadowmoon valley, but that's it, the other zones are far. And for the horde, every single zone that matters is as far removed from the capital as it can be.
It would've been SO much better to have the capital (or capitals) in talador. In this regard, even their original plan of having Bladespire and Karabor as capitals would have still been less convenient than in previous expansions, as neither of those zones are centric.
On a related topic, we are about eight months into the expansion, and it is over. Eight months! We haven't even been killing stuff in Warlord's for a year and we're done with patch content. I really hope they put in some smaller ones to add some additional things to the game. Maybe not raid worthy stuff, but something. Otherwise we're going to have a long wait of little to hope for but the eventual release of the movie.
As I mentioned
here
, its a lot worse than most people think.
Best case scenario which requires A LOT of optimism and that nothing goes wrong, and that beta begins the very next day after the announcement on blizzcon: 10-12 months with no new content.
Most Likely Case scenario: 18 months of waiting if they take 1 year of development from announcement to release (which was the case in MoP and WoD).
Worst case scenario: 22 months of waiting, just shy of
two years
, if they take 1.5 years of development from announcement to release (which was the case in TBC, WOTLK, and CATA)
We're gonna need a miracle for this one. The only way it takes less than 12 months of waiting, is if the expansion announcement, AND the expansion beta, BOTH happen BEFORE blizzcon. Which, while not impossible, is also
extremely
unlikely.
Post by
oneforthemoney
To be honest, I'm beginning to wonder what went through Blizz's head when they designed this expansion. I'm looking at it, and it seems like they told the writers what they wanted, gave them enough time to fit in the foundation of Draenor, then punted them aside and tried to turn what they had into a complete expansion, rushing it through.
Contrast with Wrath. In Wrath, we have the Lich King and Ulduar. We begin with three raids: Naxx's wings (recycled, but still good), Occulus, and Obsidium Sanctum. All three have stories in the game which build them up independently. Following this, first patch brings us Ulduar. After this, we get Argent Tournament. After this, Icecrown, and after this, Ruby Sanctum. And throughout all this, we also have Wintergrasp.
In WoD? Most zones culminate in a dungeon. We have Highmaul, not even at launch, with the ogres who had a disjointed presence throughout the expansion, at best, without any single driving story aside from maybe Nagrand. We have Blackrock Foundry, which was good and well established for storyline, and is really the penultimate Iron Horde raid. Then, we have Hellfire, which features the Legion, who though with ample build up, have Archimonde as last boss who had all of one cameo in the expansion proper before this.
It seems to me that there was simply a lack of time for the writers to do something with all they had. They got the foundation laid and were expected to build a palace out of it. The result is we blew through what we had. Blizzard's tactic right now seems to be short term profit to the expense of long term, which is amazingly stupid because they're one of the only games who still go by a subscription system.
It's all so dumb.
Post by
Skreeran
I'm planning on getting into LotRO, myself. At least the devs can't ruin that lore.
Post by
Atik
I'm planning on getting into LotRO, myself. At least the devs can't ruin that lore.
I dunno.
The guys who did ESO managed to ruin that lore. I wouldn't count your chickens before they hatch.
Post by
oneforthemoney
This
is interesting. Specifically the fact they're exploring the lore pre Last guardian in the series. So...either expanding content and creating new bad guys? Or adding space for more time travel whatever.
Post by
Rankkor
I'm planning on getting into LotRO, myself. At least the devs can't ruin that lore.
I fully recommend you to get into Star Wars The Old Republic. If you're into star wars at all, that MMO is amazing. It was pretty meh at launch, but now they ironed it out nicely, and while the gameplay never was as good as wow, I can tell you right off the bat that the lore and the story of that game, make wow's story look like a poorly written fanfic.
With a new expansion coming this october (at the really cheap price of 15 dollars) and with no sub required, this game is a must-have.
I tried LOTRO once, but blah, that gameplay was horrible. I just couldn't get into it.
This
is interesting. Specifically the fact they're exploring the lore pre Last guardian in the series. So...either expanding content and creating new bad guys? Or adding space for more time travel whatever.
Could that be the same book that Christie Golden announced she was writing? She did say on her twitter account that she's working on a new wow novel that acts as a prequel to the warcraft movie. Which itself is pretty much based during the Last Guardian.
Post by
oneforthemoney
It said Chronicles volume 1, so a definite possibility. WoW might end up going the Dragonlance route, where the game is still big, but they begin putting more focus on supplementary books to expand the lore and history before only hinted at. Not sure if good or bad, as Dragonlance really dropped in quality when they tried to steer towards a grimmer in totality world.
Post by
470415
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
I fully recommend you to get into Star Wars The Old Republic. If you're into star wars at all, that MMO is amazing. It was pretty meh at launch, but now they ironed it out nicely, and while the gameplay never was as good as wow, I can tell you right off the bat that the lore and the story of that game, make wow's story look like a poorly written fanfic.
With a new expansion coming this october (at the really cheap price of 15 dollars) and with no sub required, this game is a must-have.
As someone who played TOR at launch and has been playing it on-again-off-again since it went F2P (and is a huge advocate for both KotOR games) ...
Plzno. TOR is good, but its not that good. The individual storylines for the classes
are
fantastic and I would reccomend them, but the story as a whole is at best half-decent fanfiction and all the important lore is based on REALLY BAD fanfiction.
Are you sure about that? I really loved the Rise of the Hutts story, and the Shadow of Revan story was fantastic (Minus the teasing with lana that went nowehre >_>) and the latest patch with the emperor on Ziost was really awesome. The next expansion looks equally amazing too. What didn't you liked of the story as a whole?
////// overlooks burning pyre of copies of the Revan novel
ohh yes, that book is an abomination. On the whole, I dislike that they turned revan from the interesting character s/he was in KOTOR to just a generic baddie, but the Cult of Revan as a whole, struck me as "The Twilight Hammer cult done right..... IN SPACE!!!!!". Frankly, they presented a far more interesting adversary than revan himself.
also the game is actually pretty hard to play without a sub, since your XP is reduced and your currency is capped, which keeps you from doing a lot of stuff. I've actually stopped playing for a time until I can cobble together the cash to sub because I can't stand playing it F2P anymore--its just too frustrating.
How long as it been since you've played? because they've made it a lot more bearable to play. As a former subscriber, I'm "prefered" so my currency cap is a lot more reasonable (350k) the XP reduction is only 20% and its barely noticeable. I leveled my Agent from 1 to 60 as a freebie, and never was lagging behind on XP. The only difference between being a sub and not being a sub is that you have the luxury of skipping a few side-quests due to the 20% exp boost. Kinda like playing wow with a couple of heirlooms removed. A bit harder? maybe, but nowhere near frustrating or inconvenient.
The limit in action bars is also a lot more reasonable as a prefered player, getting 4 action bars, and if you get a friend code by a subscriber, you get the friendship pack which adds a ton of unlocakble goodies to your toons (an extra action bar, access to titles, access to an extra profession, extra tab on inventory, etc). Almost all the restrictions can be unlocked by buying the items in the auction house, and the few that cost above 350k can be bypassed if you have a friend to lend a hand. Last time, I bought the mercenary contract for Treek for 2 million credits, all I did was have a guildie buy it for me, and I paid him the 2 million in several quotas of 350k each over a couple of weeks. Considering you can easily get 300k per day on dailies alone, it wasn't that hard.
Post by
470415
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Skreeran
I'm probably still going into LotRO. I was into Star Wars as a kid (the first three movies), but I never could get into any of the Expanded Universe stuff (with the notable exception of the original Clone Wars shorts; you know, the one where they revealed General Greivous as a massive badass and not a hacking, choking loser who gets shot in the chest like a chump).
If TOR was more like a Rogue Squadron Online game with a lot of space combat and stuff, I might be interested in it, but I never finished the KotOR games (don't hate me!), and never really cared about the Old Republic stuff.
Lord of the Rings, on the other hand, I've been a fan of since I was 10 (and only saw the movies as a reward for finishing the respective book), and having just finished War in the North, I am feeling in a pretty good mood for more LotR lore. It was so much fun running around Rivendell and the Ettenmoors in War in the North, I'm looking forward to doing the same in Edoras and Helm's Deep and Moria.
I don't know, it's been a while since I played Lotro, and last time I did, it felt too WoW-clone-y for me to really enjoy it, but having gone a couple years without WoW now, I don't expect it will bother me. And like I said, with the whole Lotro story taking place in-between The Hobbit and The Return of the King, it seems like it'd be a lot harder to ruin that story than it is for WoW, which has basically run out of characters I care about.
Post by
Atik
Skree...
Space combat is actually a HUGE part of TOR...
Post by
Skreeran
Skree...
Space combat is actually a HUGE part of TOR...Really. Huh. Well maybe I'll give it a shot after all.
Post by
Rankkor
Prefacing this with a disclaimer: I actually haven't played the expansions yet, I didn't want to spend money on the game when they came out so I never bothered picking them up. I'll be doing so once I go back and sub. Therefore, can't judge the quality of the expanion storylines, just the base game.
Ahhh, there we go.
Well, if I'm not mistaken, you get the first expansion for free just by subscribing, its not for sale anymore. And the same deal will go for the next one, it will be free by buying one month of subscription, it wont be possible to just buy the expansion separately.
Indeed the "Post-50" content in vanilla SWTOR wasn't all that good, but trust me on this, the story in the expansions has been pretty entertaining.
Which I will go on to reiterate, the individual class storylines are amazing. Very well written, very engaging, full of depth and awesome characters and plot twists. I haven't gotten through all of them, sadly, but I keep wanting to replay the ones I have because they were just so much fun (sort of a neverending problem in that regard.)
Yeah, this right here is my main problem with this game being an MMO. If I want to replay a badass moment I have to level that same character from scratch. Which sucks.
So I have no problem with those, it's the lore as a whole. I know you love and have a lot of investment in the original Warcraft lore Rankorr, what they built up in the original games and are currently tearing apart with a rusty spork.
TOR did that to the KotOR games.
At least for me, and those two RPGs are my childhood and the entire reason I got seriously into gaming.
1: That is one awesome analogy and I hope you don't mind if I use it later :P
2: Yeah, the sacrilegious defilement they did to the source material was a kick in the liver. In that regard, I can agree with your assessment that the game screwed up big time. I can understand why they did that (Revan was such a massive character, that they used him to lure new people into the game. Basically the "
Wolverine Effect
". but it doesn't changes the fact that it was a low blow for fans of the source material)
For one, KotOR3 got cancelled in favor of pushing out TOR, which I'm still bitter about.
No arguments here. I
still
maintain that SWTOR could have been a massive award-winning spectacular groundbreaking game IF it was released as a single-player game that could be played in Co-Op, with 8 class stories that you could play either by yourself, or with a friend. Instead of a very blatant wow-clone it ended up being. And yes, just like wow killed any chances of ever having a warcraft 4, SWTOR ended any chances of a KOTOR 3, for which I'm also saddened as well. =(
Secondly, someone at Bioware/EA had the delicious idea of having someone write a novel and making canon version of Revan and the Jedi Exile (which to put that into perspective, is like someone deciding to make a canon Shepard. Or canon versions of the Dragon Age protagonists.) As well as retconning most of KotOR2 and generally just forgetting the Exile ever existed or is important at all.
Bleh, I know, that book trilogy is awful. I guess it doesn't affect me as much as it does to you because KOTOR wasn't the cornerstone game of my childhood (Chrono Trigger was) but I can totally understand
why
you feel that way (because Chrono Trigger was equally defiled by a horrible sequel, Chrono Cross, which I loathe with all my might)
Now, this might not be that much of a problem if I could ignore it, but TOR likes to push their canon Revan in your face--something that the whole Shadow of Revan expansion DEFINITELY did not help with at all. Anything that has to do with that man's ugly mug makes me want to punch someone. It just sort of sweeps my childhood under the rug and says "Here! Enjoy this game built off of the adventures of two people who are nothing like the two people you remember them as!"
To be fair, in the vanilla SWTOR, Revan shows up for exactly 2 dungeons and that's it. Never again mentioned (There's a cult that worships him on Dromund Kaas, but its no different than someone worshiping the idea of a person, rather than the person itself) And in Shadow of Revan, surprisingly, there's very little of Revan himself, I don't wanna post spoilers, but despite his name being on the expansion, and his face (or rather face-mask) being on the loading screen, he himself plays almost no role at all in the plot and dies almost immediately.
So in my head canon, that guy is just a pretender that did a really good job at faking being revan. >_> That's how I rationalized it. (Which requires heavy doses of suspension of disbelief, because in my head canon, revan is a girl :P)
I guess for some people this isn't really that big of a deal, but it really pushes my buttons the wrong way. The stories of TOR aren't bad, but the lore they're derived from is what really gets me.
I understand where you're coming from. When I mentioned that the story beats wow into the bushes, is because for starters, other than revan, there's hardly any defilement of old characters (on account of all of them being dead) and because the present characters are far better written, far more believable, far more relatable (Even the bad guys) and plain simply far more interesting to watch. Whereas the warlords in WoD were all carbon-copies of each other personality-wise, in SWTOR, there's a high variety of Sith and Jedi. Darth Malgus is very different from Darth Marr, who in turn is very different from Darth Baras, etc.
It makes the story something I actually wish to partake on. Even if I'm sour that they had to do a big disservice to one AWESOME game to do it, at least it did better than what wow did. SWTOR sacrificed a titan of a story, to create a mere giant.
Wow, sacrificed a titan of a story, to create a misshapen flea. =/
Stopped playing about a month ago. I'm also a preferred member and I literally can't buy any of the stuff I'd like to buy at 350k credits, which includes everything from finishing off stronghold expansions to cartel market stuff.
Yeah, I don't bother with any of the stronghold stuff. Odd though, because I can buy a lot of the cartel market stuff with the credit limits that I have.
... additionally all your workarounds require other people, which is highly inconvenient for me seeing as I don't know anybody else who plays (let alone subscribes) and would rather not have to join a guild of strangers and beg for a loan when I want to play on my own time at my own pace.
I can understand this. I was a lone wolf for most of my time in SWTOR, only joined a guild recently (About 4 months ago) and they've been really nice. When they asked me to join on a raid and I mentioned that I couldn't (due to not being a sub) they offered me that workaround service if I wanted to buy something that was above my credit limit. I would have never gotten treek without them.
As for the experience, I've found that even doing every quest possible and trying to keep XP boosts from quests on, I'm still always one or two levels behind reccomended planet levels
Seriously? o_O that's odd. I leveled a very squishy agent, and I was always ahead of the curve when it came to the recommended level for planets. Do you also do your daily Tactical Flashpoint? you get easily 1/3 of a level for the first one you do every day. I always did that when leveling my characters. Maybe that's why you are a few bars behind? (Do note that unlike the normal flashpoints, which give a paltry sum of exp and are generally not worth it, the Tactical Flashpoint Kuat Drive Yards gives a massive amount of EXP, and massive amount of commendations so you can keep your gear updated all the time.)
Skree...
Space combat is actually a HUGE part of TOR...Really. Huh. Well maybe I'll give it a shot after all.
Yep, there's 2 very different versions of Space Combat in SWTOR.
From a PVE perspective, you get your own ship at around lvl 16-ish, and you can equip it with different weapons, armor and so on. However, if you're not a subscriber, you can only do 3 space combat missions per week. Even if you are a subscriber, the PVE space combat is essentially an on-rails shooter (Think Star Fox) and not very exciting (at least for me)
From a PVP perspective however, its an entirely different matter. In PVP Space Combat is basically a game of its own, with different ship classes, different ship models within those classes, lots of different talent builds for your ship to customize, large scale battles, this one plays a lot more like Wing Commander, if you ever played that awesome classic.(##RESPBREAK##)520##DELIM##Rankkor##DELIM##
Post by
Skreeran
Yep, there's 2 very different versions of Space Combat in SWTOR.
From a PVE perspective, you get your own ship at around lvl 16-ish, and you can equip it with different weapons, armor and so on. However, if you're not a subscriber, you can only do 3 space combat missions per week. Even if you are a subscriber, the PVE space combat is essentially an on-rails shooter (Think Star Fox) and not very exciting (at least for me)
From a PVP perspective however, its an entirely different matter. In PVP Space Combat is basically a game of its own, with different ship classes, different ship models within those classes, lots of different talent builds for your ship to customize, large scale battles, this one plays a lot more like Wing Commander, if you ever played that awesome classic.Yeah, Star Fox was great, but I wouldn't write home about it.
I never played Wing Commander, but if it's anything like the old Rogue Squadron games (i.e. large areas, full 3D movement, etc.) I'd probably enjoy it. I think Star Citizen was supposed to be a spiritual sequel to the Wing Commander games, and that one was on my list of MMOs to check out too.
So yeah, I'll probably give TOR a fair shake. My brother is already into LotRO, which is part of why I had settled on that, but there's nothing wrong with trying out several MMOs, imo. I even gave EVE a chance some time ago. That one was a trip, for sure.
Post by
Rankkor
This is pretty funny. Someone posted a
screenshot
of Yrel on our Main Timeline.
This seriously made my day.
Post by
oneforthemoney
Oh that's mean. Hilarious, but mean.
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