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Post by
morginar
In other news, I just headed to the Inn on my garrison after a long hard day on Draenor to have myself a drink. I spot over to the corner to see who's our guest for the day, and I spot none other than Lilian Voss, so I approach her in a friendly manner watching her sulk staring at a corner with her back turned on me.
I go "Yo' s'up lily-girl, are you still brooding?" and tap her gently on the shoulder. She turns to face me and
SWEET JESUS!
Uhh I need a change of pants, brb.
Thats charming...
Looking at your quests, how's Thisalee Crow?
Ohhh yisss, the alliance troops know who's the boss
(Minor Glitch, the "Call to Arms" ability summons a small squad of troops to help you out, as horde, it supposed to be usable only on Frostfire Ridge, and summon horde troops. As alliance, its supposed to be usable only on Shadowmoon Valley and summon alliance troops. But due to a glitch I was able to use it as horde on Shadowmoon and much to my surprise, it summoned alliance troops that followed my orders and fought for me :P)
And by all that's holy, alliance players are very lucky to have Shadowmoon as their zone. SOOO PRETTY.
See what I mean?
Frostfire Ridge looks very generic in comparison. Its like Storm Peaks, but with all the cool titan stuff replaced by jagged rocks and lava. Hurray? =/
Again looking at your quests, who do you think "the huntress" is? The other inn guests are people we meet before, so the same goes for her IMHO.
And shadowmoon is pretty so pretty. To bad Ashran gets to be capital island...
Post by
Morec0
New Lords of War:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRnabRRi1ik
Still love the art, the story is epic.
Grom is a badass.
Post by
Rankkor
That was a good chapter but not as good as the previous one. Then again, the previous one was clearly heavily inspired by Spartacus of which I'm a HUGE fan of, so there's some clear bias in there for me xD.
Hopefully the one about Durotan will be more awesome.
Its a shame they're not covering all the warlords. As far as I know, they're doing Kargath, Grom, Durotan, Kilrogg, and Ner'zhul.
Post by
Skreeran
I want most to know about Kilrogg and Blackhand. Kargath was cool (and metal as hell; his design reminds me so much of Nathan Explosion from Metalocalypse), but Kilrogg is the chieftain of Gurka's clan, and Blackhand of Nakresh. Not that the other clans aren't cool, but they just don't mean as much to me.
Post by
morginar
I hoped for something on Gorehowl and the hellscream title name.
It was a bit predictable that he was going to hellbite the ogers neck. In my opinion a hellscream directly into the ear that blows his head up with skyrim music in the background would have been more epic.
It was good nonetheless though bladefist reign supreme.
Post by
Adamsm
You know, the fact that the Ogre empire seems to still be going in the Alternate Draenor possibly says something huge is missing from that time line....Mainly a certain building sized one eye beast man and his seven sons; I know the Iron Horde has captured and converted Gronn into walking mobile weapon platforms, but where in the verse are Gruul and his sons?
Post by
Skreeran
He's a boss in Blackrock Foundry.
Wowpedia calls him "Gruul the Subjugated."
Post by
oneforthemoney
You know, the fact that the Ogre empire seems to still be going in the Alternate Draenor possibly says something huge is missing from that time line....Mainly a certain building sized one eye beast man and his seven sons; I know the Iron Horde has captured and converted Gronn into walking mobile weapon platforms, but where in the verse are Gruul and his sons?
Moreover, if we're getting the backstory from Maraad, who was from Prime Draenor, how does he know about some of these alterations should they be part of his narrative.
Post by
morginar
Think it's A: Plot hole so we know back ground for the orcs in this timeline. B: Super namekian hearing snaped up some stories orks screamed in the opening event.
For example Grom isn't the leader of the original horde in prime timeline. Blackhand is.
And alliance realy like to knock over the tiny pawn things they have on maps.
Think we will have Thrall/Drek'thar/Oik #8417 telling some of the lords of war with Thrall or Liadrin?
Post by
Adamsm
He's a boss in Blackrock Foundry.
Wowpedia calls him "Gruul the Subjugated."
Well that's a little disappointing. But guess that answers that lol.
You know, the fact that the Ogre empire seems to still be going in the Alternate Draenor possibly says something huge is missing from that time line....Mainly a certain building sized one eye beast man and his seven sons; I know the Iron Horde has captured and converted Gronn into walking mobile weapon platforms, but where in the verse are Gruul and his sons?
Moreover, if we're getting the backstory from Maraad, who was from Prime Draenor, how does he know about some of these alterations should they be part of his narrative.
I think Maraad is stating the original history, but what we're seeing how it actually went down in the Alternate verse instead....or not; it could just be Maraad is the narrator voice since it's so sexy and awesome.
Post by
Rankkor
He's a boss in Blackrock Foundry.
Wowpedia calls him "Gruul the Subjugated."
Almost all of his sons show up too. One is a boss on the Iron Docks, another is a quest boss on the final battle in FFR, another one is a bodyguard to garrosh himself, etc.
You know, the fact that the Ogre empire seems to still be going in the Alternate Draenor possibly says something huge is missing from that time line....Mainly a certain building sized one eye beast man and his seven sons; I know the Iron Horde has captured and converted Gronn into walking mobile weapon platforms, but where in the verse are Gruul and his sons?
Moreover, if we're getting the backstory from Maraad, who was from Prime Draenor, how does he know about some of these alterations should they be part of his narrative.
This is a HUUUUUUUUUGE plot hole, because on the original timeline, the Gorian Empire was long long long gone by the time the horde formed.
Hell, when Durotan and Orgrim were both children, decades before the formation of the horde, Ogres were already dumb beasts in servitude of the Gronn.
But here, not only the ogres are intelligent, and have a sprawling (if decaying) civilization, the gronn are nothing more than brutes, and are not even at the top of their own food chain, since the Magnaron dominate over them.
It seems that Ogres are the last evolved form of gronn, and despite being the last in the chain, they have a particularly strong empire, while their progenitors are little more than primal forces.
The chain goes like this: Magnaron > Gron > Ogron > Ogre.
So Grull is not even the big cheese of primal creatures on draenor, that privilege belongs to Drov the Ruiner, currently the largest Magnaron (and creature) on draenor. Even then, the older giants were even larger, as attested by the corpse of one used as a capital by the Thunderlord Clan.
I digress however. My point stands that Maraad knowing about THESE warlords makes absolutely no sense, because THESE warlords are
not
like the original ones and the events on
this
draenor are not the same as the one he came from.
I also find it kinda funny that maraad on the first episode says to varian "I have faced them before, believe me, they are not invincible".
Brave words from one who
lost
to these warlords, and saw his entire civilization driven to the brink of extinction by them. In fact, most of these warlords
were
invincible, because no alliance hand struck them down.
Blackhand was killed by Doomhammer.
Grom was killed by Mannoroth (but only after he killed him first)
Ner'zhul became the lich king and we all know what he did with the alliance during the third war.
Bladefist survived everything and was only slain in TBC.
Gul'dan was killed in the tomb of sargeras.
and Deadeye was the only one killed by a member of the Alliance (Danath) but even then, was not by a draenei.
So a guy who's race was unable to defeat or kill even one warlord at all, now tells varian that they're not invincible.
HA! :P
Post by
Adamsm
.....You made his point though; they were all defeated, showing they are not invincible. The whole point is that Maraad is trying to provide to Varian is to not lose hope or get caught up in the memories of the past and fight on no matter what.
Post by
Rankkor
But that's the thing, they were defeated (not all of them, from every point of view Grom was undefeated his entire life) but not by
him
. Nor any of his people.
Bear in mind that he's trying to console varian, who is afraid of facing them because these same people last time razed his entire kingdom.
This is the equivalent of a game where time-traveling nazis are invading the present, the french president is worried about facing them, and then a poland WWII veteran tells him "I fought them, and they're not invincible". Funny words considering his own country was ravaged by them.
Also regarding their "defeats" almost all of them were never killed in battle, but by politics. Blackhand was never defeated on the field of battle, only by Orgrim, one of his own, who proved to be an even more dangerous warlord than him. Grom was never defeated, period, he evaded the alliance all his life after the second war was over, and when Thrall and Jaina faced him they had to contain him in a soul stone to have any hope of subdue him. Ner'zhul to this day has never been defeated, we beat his physical host arthas, but Ner'zhul himself is still very much alive and we all know one day he's gonna be back. Gul'dan was never defeated in battle, he was killed by his ambition.
and so on.
So it is kinda funny that a guy who always lost to these warlords would brag about them not being invincible, when he himself never once was able to defeat any of them, and said warlords sent him and his people into hiding to avoid total annihilation.
If you ask me, this whole saga should had been narrated by Danath, an actual alliance hero who DID bested one of the warlords in single combat.
Post by
Adamsm
but Ner'zhul himself is still very much alive and we all know one day he's gonna be back. Um...Rank,
dead
; also:
^ Arthas: Rise of the Lich King, epilogue. "Arthas, the Lich King, alone in his glory and power, slowly opened his eyes."
^ Warcraft: Legends Volume 4 Fate. "Ner'zhul is no more. He is consumed. There is only Arthas now... Arthas, whom you shall serve for all eternity."
^ BlizzCon 2010 Lore Q&A Panel. "Yeah, Ner'zhul is done. He served us well in that capacity, but really the Lich King idea... really has the ultimate expression, you know, as Arthas or whatever. Ner'zhul's done."There is still the Lich King floating around in the Helm, but Ner'zhul himself is long gone.
Post by
oneforthemoney
Blackhand was never defeated on the field of battle, only by Orgrim, one of his own, who proved to be an even more dangerous warlord than himAlso, Doomhammer: Dead by Alliance at Blackrock. So yeah.
Grom was never defeated, period, he evaded the alliance all his life after the second war was over, and when Thrall and Jaina faced him they had to contain him in a soul stone to have any hope of subdue him.
I always saw that as less subduing him as hoping to purify him. Didn't they have to kill him to get him in that?
Post by
Rankkor
Blackhand was never defeated on the field of battle, only by Orgrim, one of his own, who proved to be an even more dangerous warlord than himAlso, Doomhammer: Dead by Alliance at Blackrock. So yeah.
What? dude, Doomhammer bested the alliance champion in single combat at blackrock. You know, that one warrior everyone else thought invincible, Doomhammer killed him. He was then subdued by Turalyon only because his duel with Lothar left him severely wounded and tired. Not to mention his oponent had magic when he had none. Turalyon bested him only because Lothar softened him up (at the cost of his life) and because he had magic on his side.
If you're talking about the knight that ended up killing Doomhammer, he only manged to do that because A: Doomhammer was old, very very old, at that point. B: He attacked from behind while Doomhammer was retreating. C: he was on horseback against an unmounted oponent. D: He had 4 other knights to accompany him.
Even with all of the above in consideration, Doomhammer was still able to kill his killer, and his entire escort, appoint a successor, and THEN he died.
On his prime? and without wounds? he truly
was
invincible.
Post by
oneforthemoney
Ah, right. Sorry, I got mixed up. Though I do contend the idea Lothar was thought of as invincible. The man was pushing sixty by the time he faced off with Doomhammer. Take a look at his portrait:
http://wowpedia.org/File:Lothar_TCG.jpg
Post by
Monday
dude, Doomhammer bested the alliance champion in single combat at blackrock.
It's implied in several different places that Lothar was killed by some orc warriors during the battle with Doomhammer (see: both the Alliance and Horde player guides).
Does that not make this point:
D: He had 4 other knights to accompany him.
Completely worthless, then?
Post by
Adamsm
Player guides fall under the RPG though, which is non-canon now...and you know, Tides of Darkness(the book) came out after them, which is where Doomhammer shatters Lothar blade and crushes his chest, and then our favorite paladin realizes that the orcs are outside of the Light, picks up the broken blade and proceeds to kick Doomhammer's teeth down his throat in full on Gentle Fury mode. Even then, Doomhammer was imprisoned for several years before breaking free and fleeing, and does eventually die due to a wound from behind...of course, he also killed those 5 knights before he finally went down.
Post by
Monday
That's right, I forgot Tides of Darkness came after that.
But either way, wasn't it less that they were non-canon and more that they remain dubiously canon until specifically contradicted?
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