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General Lore Discussions
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Post by
Atik
I'm not even sure if I could keep playing if they killed Sylvannas or made her a villain or dethroned her. I mean, all of the leades have a tendacy to do radically stupid things; Garrosh and Varian clearly taking the cake.
The thing with Sylvannas is that I, personnally, can understand her. I understand why she, of all the stupid people with armies, does these crazy things. She is broken, ever since Wrath, she has been devestated. Putress' betrayal and Tirion denying her the sole goal in her unlife completely ripped her world apart.
She seems tired of it all, the war and pain and undeath. She hates how her people are treated as cursed monsters while Death Knights and Worgens are perfectly accepted. So she has gone on this crazy crusade, possibly without reason, possibly to make everyone feel the same pain she has to.
This is actually MORE than the simple "treat them as a monster and they become one", this is "Treat them as a monster, apply double standards, stab them in the back, and deny them of the only thing they ask for, and they become monsters".
Just my thoughts.
Post by
Adamsm
well morec, she kinda DID brought it upon herself. She's been turning humans unwillingly into forsakens left and right. While some may have resigned to their fates, others may have resisted and refused to join her, there are others (like godfrey) who merely pretended to be on her side, but were plotting against her.
I'm more than willing to believe that that Galen is among them, as well as any number of former alliance recently turned to forsakens.
She has made more enemies than friends recently, and many of those enemies are within her own ranks, so she's concerned that another one may pull a varimathras on her.
This paranoia WILL bite her in the ass eventually. As I can see some of her truly loyal forces being alienated due to her own paranoid concerns
Provided the new recruits have minds of their own of course...some of what Galen says, makes it sound like he's being forced to do what he does, as if he has no choice in the matter......
Post by
Atik
well morec, she kinda DID brought it upon herself. She's been turning humans unwillingly into forsakens left and right. While some may have resigned to their fates, others may have resisted and refused to join her, there are others (like godfrey) who merely pretended to be on her side, but were plotting against her.
I'm more than willing to believe that that Galen is among them, as well as any number of former alliance recently turned to forsakens.
She has made more enemies than friends recently, and many of those enemies are within her own ranks, so she's concerned that another one may pull a varimathras on her.
This paranoia WILL bite her in the ass eventually. As I can see some of her truly loyal forces being alienated due to her own paranoid concerns
Provided the new recruits have minds of their own of course...some of what Galen says, makes it sound like he's being forced to do what he does, as if he has no choice in the matter......
I assumed he would have been killed so fast his head spun.
I mean, if he had no free will, why would he even talk like that?
Post by
355559
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
I assumed he would have been killed so fast his head spun.
I mean, if he had no free will, why would he even talk like that?
Members of the Scourge spoke the exact same way, and the Lich King never killed them.
Wasn't there some talk that the val'kyr were still under the banner of the scourge secretly or osmething like that and it was all a ploy to bring the forsaken back in?
I think it's more that the Val'kyr are tying all the new Forsaken to Sylvanas so that she can control them as she needs to, whether they want to be a part of her group or not.
Post by
Atik
Doesn't the first Forsaken quest state, in black and yellow, that the Val'Kyr can't do that?
And other than the one horseman, I can't think of a single scourge who spoke like that.
Post by
Adamsm
Doesn't the first Forsaken quest state, in black and yellow, that the Val'Kyr can't do that?
And other than the one horseman, I can't think of a single scourge who spoke like that.
Sylvanas herself? She railed against Arthas, but he still forced her to use her scream on her own people and others. And there were others in the old quests, as well as in Northrend.
Post by
Atik
Admittedly, I never played the RTS games.
But I haonestly tried to think of all the undead in Northrened. And any that spoke seemed to be more than happy about being undead.
Post by
oneforthemoney
Anub'arak occasionally had his bouts of lucidity and melancholy.
Post by
355559
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Post by
870547
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Post by
306612
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
Provided the new recruits have minds of their own of course...some of what Galen says, makes it sound like he's being forced to do what he does, as if he has no choice in the matter......
Ejem, bro' the new recruits DO have a mind of their own. Forsaken NEVER force anyone to serve. This is specially shown on the starting zone, where the valks rezzed 3 new recruits and you're tasked to talk to them. The first one refuses to join the forsakens and tries to return to her people (Voss) only to be rejected and nearly killed by her former comrades. The second one not only refused to join the forsaken, he grabbed other recently revived forsakens and tried to stage a revolt, attacking deathkneel, and thus was slain (Marshal Redpath) and the third one, merely shrugged and joined the forsakens.
Even after proving how ridiculously overpowered she was, at no point they forced Voss to join them, and even today, she's a "wild card" working only for herself and simply killing crusaders.
Galen, (as sigma said) is working for the forsakens, simply because its human nature to wish to continue to exist. He knows damn well that as an undead, if he ever comes near stromgarde, his own friends wont hesitate to kill him on sight, and he doesn't wanna kill himself either. So his only way to continue living on a world that now hates him, is to work with the forsakens.
I provided a rather good example a while ago (Using a real-life analogy with Lepers) why new recruits work for their former enemy.
However I did said that while they work for the forsaken, I very much doubt they are happy with their new positions in life, and many (if not all of them) will harbor deep resentment to the one who imposed this cursed existence upon them (Banshee Queen)
Post by
Rankkor
Back to Koltira/Thassarian here. The contrast between the two is simple, actually : Thassarian accepted his role as a soldier of the Alliance. Koltira is still conflicted. Thassarian doesn't hesitate to retake Andorhal - Koltira respects his pact with Thassarian and doesn't mobilize.
I disagree with you there man, Koltira has also accepted his role as a horde soldier, and he WAS just as determined to take Andorhal as Thassarian was. However, Koltira was a pragmatist first. He knew that before Andorhal would be taken, the scourge would need to be dealt with first, but he made it clear that once the scourge was removed, he would face Thassarian, and would not go easy on him in any way.
Sylvannas was completely in the wrong for question Koltira's loyalty just because he displayed some COMMON SENSE.
Its a lot smarter to first take out the mutual enemy and then settle for the land. Trying to take on 2 enemies at the same time would only put a strain on your own forces. This is basic-tactics 101 bro'
Post by
306612
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
The thing is, did he or did he not let his friendship with Thassarian cloud his judgment after Andorhal was free of the Scourge? He did.
Disagree. I did those quests and he DID pressed and eventually expelled the alliance forces out of Andorhal. What Sylvannas was pissed off at was that he made a truce with Thassarian in the first place. But Koltira's commitment to win the battle was 100% solid.
He specifficaly said to Thassarian that once the scourge was out of the way, the gloves were off. Just because he didn't charged ala Leeroy Jenkins doesn't mean he was willing to let the alliance win the battle.
Post by
Atik
Just asking here, since a fan-fic idea struck me.
What is the possible age range for a half-orc half-tauren? Around ten, similiar to half-Nelfs?
Post by
Adamsm
Just asking here, since a fan-fic idea struck me.
What is the possible age range for a half-orc half-tauren? Around ten, similiar to half-Nelfs?
Yes.
And just read the new leader story for Sylvanas.....okay, Gallywix is still the worse of them, but her's just stunk massively; more of that damn time skip writing, having her up on Icecrown after the fall of the King, and showing why the Val'kyr follow her.....yeah, because she's 'like them' /roll eyes.
The only good thing in the story was actually Garrosh.
Post by
Atik
I hate the leader stories TBH. Really annoying to read through, and I feel like I'm not getting anything I really care about from them.
Post by
306612
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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