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General Lore Discussions
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Post by
Skreeran
By the way, I've been questing in Howling Fjord and have a little more insight on the battle there. Not much, but a little.
For one thing, according to
The New Plague
, the Alliance had intercepted the ship carrying the latest strain of Blight. Whether that means that the battle was ongoing while the new ship carrying the Blight sailed in, or if that was what set off the battle, I can't say, but it's interesting to know.
The fleet in Darkton's picture (
http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20090222122904/wowwiki/images/a/ac/The_North_Fleet.jpg
) are the reservists sent to reinforce the ships battling the Forsaken. They haven't even participated in the battle at all yet.
According to
Reports from the Field
, we know that the Alliance 'fort' was built after the bulk of the battle. I remember if this was in debate or not, but it's confirmed now.
Post by
Rankkor
=O (making goblin voice) hummm intresting............
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
451455
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
Dave, don't lie. You said several times and gave false proof (Which I proved wrong and you're ignoring the evidence) that the humans attacked the Forsaken.
ya know what? screw it, it aint worth my time.
I'll just take the cheap route and here it goes......
"Sure thing frankie, whatever you say boss, if it makes ya happy, go ahead and think that way"
I've been proving it for the last three pages
u've been talking for the last 3 pages, not a single link of proof of what you say, not a single one.........
Post by
Skreeran
Said reports are below, according to a wowhead poster:
It is those two cannons along the wall that are slowing us down. Without their protection our forces would be able to rush their fortification without taking any losses.
It's either take out those cannons or wait until they run out of ammunition. Anselm's choice, I suppose.
What does it look like? The ground is frozen like a rock!
The wheels on these meatwagons were built to go over mud at best. We're going to need an abomination and some chains to salvage them.
I don't think that the time of building was mentioned.Quest text:
We've managed to destroy their easternmost fleet; but the survivors have barricaded themselves on the Derelict Strand, south of here.
So they barricaded themselves in after the easternmost fleet was destroyed.
The blight is in one of the ships that the Alliance survivors destroyed after the first encounter.
Ergo, survivors and after.Meh, you're assuming things.
The ship is wrecked. We don't know who wrecked it. Maybe it was the survivors. Maybe it was the fleet.
I know that it sure is hard to
intercept
a ship from the mainland.
The Forsaken refer to underestimating the Alliance earlier, the Alliance ships are far away and would have to have been attacked by plan, Anselm says he will attack the Alliance where ever he sees them, the Forsaken never mention once that the Alliance originaly attacked them, and the marines are in to proper condition to fight.
There is indirect proof that the Forsaken started the fight everywhere. You don't need solid proof to know that, its something we can assume.No, there really isn't.
I've done crazy amounts of research on this one battle, and the fact is, we just don't know who started it.
We get to Northrend, we learn the there's a battle between the Alliance and the Forsaken. The Forsaken are winning. The Alliance has reinforcements on the way.
That's about all we know.
We don't know who started it.
Post by
Rankkor
The Forsaken refer to underestimating the Alliance earlier, the Alliance ships are far away and would have to have been attacked by plan, Anselm says he will attack the Alliance where ever he sees them, the Forsaken never mention once that the Alliance originaly attacked them, and the marines are in to proper condition to fight.
There is
indirect
proof that the Forsaken started the fight everywhere.
You don't need solid proof
to know that,
its something we can assume
that's the thing.....
indirect evidence (wich is subject to interpretation by the point of view) is USELESS, you DO NEED SOLID PROOF. and NOTHING IN A DISCUSSION CAN BE ASSUMED.
what you listed there is your PERSONAL point of view of the situation with nothing solid to back it up.
on a discussion nothing is to be assumed "cuz is common sence".
that's not how a proper discussion works.
Post by
Atik
Can I change the subject real quick?
So ghouls, liches, and other undead are sorta like movie-based zombies right?
Does the "blow their brains out" method still work for an insta-kill? Also, can a lich's arcane bubble deflect bullets and arrows? Or some massive battle-axe swinging at their face?
Post by
Adamsm
Lichs can't die as long as their phylactery is intact; that's how KT keeps coming back. But yeah, take out the head and the Scourge falls, or the Forsaken.
Post by
GVHB
take out the head and the Scourge falls, or the Forsaken.
That work for everyone really.
And this rise the question, is there any race (or individual) that can survive decapitation (apart for Kael'thas obviously)?
Post by
Adamsm
take out the head and the Scourge falls, or the Forsaken.
That work for everyone really.
And this rise the question, is there any race (or individual) that can survive decapitation (apart for Kael'thas obviously)?
Not really, and even Kael was brought back to life with necromancy. Maybe the Mechanognomes, but that's probably it.
Post by
Rankkor
take out the head and the Scourge falls, or the Forsaken.
That work for everyone really.
And this rise the question, is there any race (or individual) that can survive decapitation (apart for Kael'thas obviously)?
of course.....
Hydras ;)
they have multiple heads, and it's logical to assume that as long as at least 1 head remains, the hydra should remain alive, same could apply to 2head ogres, cut 1 of the heads and the ogre "Should" remain alive....... hummm that's a theory we're gonna have to practice on Cho'gall.
So ghouls, liches, and other undead are sorta like movie-based zombies right?
not really, in the movies zombies are usually slow, crave for flesh as their only goal, and also infect whoever they bite with their undead disease.
on WoW, most undead are quite fast (ghouls being able to do those massive leaps, and in the case of geists, so agile they can do quite the number of acrobatic feats, like climbing cliffs, and walking in the walls), although they crave for flesh, their ultimate goal is to obey whoever necromancer resurrected them to life, and in WoW you don't become undead "just" for being bitten, simple exposure to the plage of the scourge is enough (though lore-wise paladins should be inmune to the stuff, wich makes the death of crusader brindenbrad quite stupid)
That (decapitation) works for everyone really.
not quite, is true that if decapitated any race will cease to function, but there are exeptions, Undead Can survive dismemberment, as their blood is coagulated already they will not "bleed to death", while other races that get dismembered usually die unless they recieve MASSIVE MEDICAL ATTENTION, and even dismembered the undead are still a threat till you cut off their heads (or use holy magic to dispell the black magic that reanimated them in the first place)
only other race that can survive dismemberment are Trolls (although they take a while to be active in duty when they lose a limb, if they lose the head they will die) and Golems, or other forms of artificial constructs that are esentially reanimated via Magic.
and last but not least, Liches are a special form of undeath, they store their souls into special artifacts called "phylacteries" (Usually an object they held dear while alive) as long as their phylactery isn't broken, the lich cannot truly be killed.
as a last point, every single mechanic race (iron dwarves, mechagnomes, iron vrykuls, and most of the robots you find in ulduar) can survive any sort of dismemberment because they are machines, as long as someone puts them back togheter, and repairs them, they will ALLWAYS be functional again.
Post by
Morec0
take out the head and the Scourge falls, or the Forsaken.
That work for everyone really.
And this rise the question, is there any race (or individual) that can survive decapitation (apart for Kael'thas obviously)?
of course.....
Hydras ;)
they have multiple heads, and it's logical to assume that as long as at least 1 head remains, the hydra should remain alive, same could apply to 2head ogres, cut 1 of the heads and the ogre "Should" remain alive....... hummm that's a theory we're gonna have to practice on Cho'gall.
I think both heads of the two headed ogres have to survive. I remember reading somewhere about a two-headed ogre having one head removed. The remaining head had enough time to shout "brother" before it died.
Post by
Adamsm
they have multiple heads, and it's logical to assume that as long as at least 1 head remains, the hydra should remain alive, same could apply to 2head ogres, cut 1 of the heads and the ogre "Should" remain alive....... hummm that's a theory we're gonna have to practice on Cho'gall.Aye, in the comics, when Varian took off one of the heads, the other screamed Brother, then dropped. They need both heads to survive, and so do the Hydras probably; if you cut off one, and they don't stop the blood, the thing would bleed to death, as most creatures/animals/people all have the jugular vein in the throat/neck area.
Post by
Monday
The Forsaken refer to underestimating the Alliance earlier, the Alliance ships are far away and would have to have been attacked by plan, Anselm says he will attack the Alliance where ever he sees them, the Forsaken never mention once that the Alliance originaly attacked them, and the marines are in to proper condition to fight.
There is
indirect
proof that the Forsaken started the fight everywhere.
You don't need solid proof
to know that,
its something we can assume
that's the thing.....
indirect evidence (wich is subject to interpretation by the point of view) is USELESS, you DO NEED SOLID PROOF. and NOTHING IN A DISCUSSION CAN BE ASSUMED.
what you listed there is your PERSONAL point of view of the situation with nothing solid to back it up.
on a discussion nothing is to be assumed "cuz is common sence".
that's not how a proper discussion works.
Kind of like your "Horde won AV" argument?
Post by
Behelich
Here's an idea that has been troubling me for a very long time. Say, a perfectly healthy young human is captured by a horrrrrrrrrrifically powerful lich. Does it sound at all plausible that the lich can draw the human out of the living body? Draw out completely and take up his place, I mean. If yes, what powers will the lich-now-in-a-living-body retain and does he now possess an ability to reproduce like all the humans do?
Post by
Monday
Here's an idea that has been troubling me for a very long time. Say, a perfectly healthy young human is captured by a horrrrrrrrrrifically powerful lich. Does it sound at all plausible that the lich can draw the human out of the living body? Draw out completely and take up his place, I mean. If yes, what powers will the lich-now-in-a-living-body retain and does he now possess an ability to reproduce like all the humans do?
I don't think so. The liches, when raised, have their bones mutated to different sizes and thicknesses than a normal human. If they did inhabit one, it would be a large, bulging sack of skin.
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Behelich
When I said lich, I meant only the level of necromantic power. I.e. can a powerful undead being claim a living body and be both powerful and alive?
Post by
Adamsm
Here's an idea that has been troubling me for a very long time. Say, a perfectly healthy young human is captured by a horrrrrrrrrrifically powerful lich. Does it sound at all plausible that the lich can draw the human out of the living body? Draw out completely and take up his place, I mean. If yes, what powers will the lich-now-in-a-living-body retain and does he now possess an ability to reproduce like all the humans do?
No, as said above.
When I said lich, I meant only the level of necromantic power. I.e. can a powerful undead being claim a living body and be both powerful and alive?
Only if it's a Banshee or one of the Ghost types.
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