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Post by
Gone
From what I understand the reason for arresting him was that his car radio was too loud and they couldn't hear what was going on inside the building. Although I've also heard that the guy had a lawsuit pending against the police before this happened, which if true is likely the reason he was targeted. Killing the dog was beyond unnecessary. They could have used their mace, or just let the guy go put his dog away and then rearrest him after. I hope the cop loses his @#$%ing badge.
That being said, acting like this is only a US problem is so &*!@ing asinine. Every police force in the wold has corrupt officers. Go ask Rank about some of the &*!@ he's seen the police pull in his country, then come back and try to say the US police officers are a bunch of thugs.
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Monday
But it IS a non American's fault to assume that it's only an American problem
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Monday
But it IS a non American's fault to assume that it's only an American problem
He never said that though?
Seriously. I feel that the US police make the US unsafe.
This statement directly implies that US police are worse than other countries' police.
Post by
Rankkor
Well this is a tad bit irresponsible don't you think?
I know that what I'm about to say isn't the central focus of the article I'll link but...........
A BLIND MAN OWNING A GUN!?!?!?!
Let me be the first one to say: What.The.F......................
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
I'm not sure how I feel about what's going down in Egypt. Morsi was legitimately elected after the last revolution, whether you like him or not. For the army to stage a Coup d'état at this point is going to have very far reaching consequences on democracy in Egypt.
Post by
Skreeran
I'm not sure how I feel about what's going down in Egypt. Morsi was legitimately elected after the last revolution, whether you like him or not. For the army to stage a Coup d'état at this point is going to have very far reaching consequences on democracy in Egypt.Seems like all the promise of the Arab Spring is just turning back to the same old third-world exchange of one regime for another.
Post by
Gone
I'm not sure how I feel about what's going down in Egypt. Morsi was legitimately elected after the last revolution, whether you like him or not. For the army to stage a Coup d'état at this point is going to have very far reaching consequences on democracy in Egypt.Seems like all the promise of the Arab Spring is just turning back to the same old third-world exchange of one regime for another.
Today's rebels are tomorrow's despots.
Post by
Mike
This statement directly implies that US police are worse than other countries' police.
Sorry I couldnt comment on this more in depth earlier, I was busy.
But I do understand there A LOT more countries worse off than the US in regards to law enforcement.
Now, I know there are obviously good cops who don't get heard or seen by others. and we (Non-US people) only really see the bad side of the US police on news headlines.
But what I was saying is that, the Police are supposed to make the country a safe place, and if I was in the US now, i would not feel safe because of them.
They (bad cops) just seem like they can do anything they want and get away with it by saying they felt threatened or had suspicion.
When I say that they get away, I'm saying that because that's what I've seen in the news article(s). Not once in any of the police brutality reports I've personally read, have I seen the officer get charged for what he did.
Compare that to only report I know of police brutality here in Australia. A girl was tasered for no reason. Seems like a huge different in the way Police Officers operate.
Does it all come back to the availability of Guns and other Weapons? Do the US Police Officers feel like they need to be more aggressive because there is a 90% chance that the person they're after will have a weapon?
Where as in Australia only 3.3 million of our 22.3 million residents own a firearm (15%), our officers still need to be aware that there is a possibility, but no where near as common and dangerous as the US.
I don't know, it's a sensitive topic, and one that I don't want to talk about it since i am quite biased towards it.
Post by
Magician22773
This is my opinion, from someone who has seen law enforcement from many different angles, from a criminal, and from having one of my closest friends as a cop.
First off, there are many, many "good" cops out there. I still give credit to the Deputy that arrested me in playing a HUGE part in my recovery from drugs. He treated me with respect, and spent a good hour talking to me about how I could get clean, if I wanted too. He didn't have to do that...he had me stone cold busted....but he did. And I never forgot it. A little while after my 10 year anniversary of being sober, I tracked him down, and he still remembered me. I just wanted to thank him, and let him know that he had played a huge part in making me realize I needed to get clean.
Second, and sadly, there are also a lot of "bad" cops out there. Power corrupts, and cops have an extreme amount of power. They have the ability to do things that practically no other person can do. They can detain you. They can assault you. They have a massive advantage over you in almost any situation. They are nearly always armed with multiple weapons, and they usually outnumber you. They also have the ability to take away your freedom and your rights. They can take you away from your family.
And worst off...their actions are rarely questioned, and their "word" is legally considered "better" than yours is.
A perfect example happened to me last year. I was driving down the highway, and was stuck behind a slow moving truck. The truck was going about 40 MPH in a 60 MPH zone. The vehicle behind me, a truck very similar to mine in make and color, passed both me, and the slow vehicle. As he was passing, I saw a cop hit his lights on the side of the highway. When the cop got behind me, I pulled over to let him pass, and he pulled in behind me.
Long story short, he thought I was the truck that had passed, and was speeding. I was given a ticket for doing 72 in a 60.....when I was actually doing about 40.
I fought the ticket in court, but it was my word against the officers, and in court, an officer is considered an "expert" witness...so his word trumped mine. I ended up having to pay $225, because this cop made a mistake.
All you have to do is search the hundreds of "bad cop" videos on YouTube to see that police today have some severe issues. They use way too much force with suspects...because they can. I laugh all the time watching these videos. I especially love the ones that go something like this:
COP #1 "DON'T MOVE!"
COP#2 "PUT YOUR HANDS UP!"
COP #1 "I said
DON'T MOVE!
"
Cop #1 then tackles the guy because he was moving, or Cop#2 charges him with resisting arrest because he didn't move.....damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Or how about when you see six cops standing on a guys back, neck, and head...while screaming at him to put his hands behind his back? Have 5 or 6 of your friends stand on your head and see how well you can control your arms.....you can't.
I mean, the list goes on, and on. Just a couple recent, local police stories that I can think of.
1. A cop pulled a man forcefully out of his car, slammed him on the ground, breaking his arm in the process. He did this because he told the man to get out of the car, and he didn't. The man was paralyzed from the waist down, the car had handicap plates on it, and in the video, you can clearly hear the man say "I am handicapped". The officers response, also heard on video, after throwing the elderly man out of his car was 'just because you are handicapped, does not mean you can disobey me" The man received about $70,000 from the city, but the cop was not disciplined.
2. A cop spotted a man parked behind a building. He asked why he was there. The man said he was on his lunch break, and was using the building for shade. The officer spent 40 minutes searching the man's car, finding nothing. After...he ticketed the man for "loitering". Through the whole incident, the man was respectful. When he received the ticket, he said "Thanks, ^&*!@#$"
The cop went absolutely berserk. He yanked the man's door open, pulled him out of the car, slammed him against a building, then pulled of a near perfect "body slam", knocking the man out cold.
For what? Disrespect? Nothing says you have to respect a cop. If I called another man an *!@#$%^, and beat me unconscious, he would be charged with assault. This cop at least was fired, but has been hired by another town less than 10 miles from here. No charges...It was treated like any other "workplace" violation.
Post by
asakawa
2. A cop spotted a man parked behind a building. He asked why he was there. The man said he was on his lunch break, and was using the building for shade. The officer spent 40 minutes searching the man's car, finding nothing. After...he ticketed the man for "loitering". Through the whole incident, the man was respectful. When he received the ticket, he said "Thanks, ^&*!@#$"
The cop went absolutely berserk. He yanked the man's door open, pulled him out of the car, slammed him against a building, then pulled of a near perfect "body slam", knocking the man out cold.
For what? Disrespect? Nothing says you have to respect a cop. If I called another man an *!@#$%^, and beat me unconscious, he would be charged with assault. This cop at least was fired, but has been hired by another town less than 10 miles from here. No charges...It was treated like any other "workplace" violation.
In Britain we've had quite a lot of campaigning recently around our "Section 5" law which makes it criminal to use “Insulting words or behaviour”. This was keenly felt when a drunk student was arrested and fined for "insulting" a policeman's horse (they are used sometimes in urban areas to police crowds, it's not just an off-duty policeman who owns a horse ^_^), saying “Excuse me, do you realise your horse is gay?". Bonkers!
Without meaning to push an agenda (I'm really not going there, just musing over the possible result of different approaches) I do wonder if the kind of aggression we see in so many US, police brutality videos stems from a natural reaction to police feeling that their lives are in danger all the time. In the UK armed police will be called on in specific circumstances where an armed response is required rather than the norm. But nobody is expected to be carrying guns during a normal day's law enforcement so there's no sense of bringing a truncheon to a gun-fight the rest of the time. Consequently, and you can certainly find
exceptions
to this, with use of guns requiring extra training and rigorous rules, armed police are wary of the power they're carrying.
The violent police videos and stories are certainly scary but I just wonder if there's an extent to which one can't blame these people for being scared and reacting by using extreme force. Actually "Can't blame" is wrong, we can and should, but an extent to which we can understand where it comes from. Things escalate quickly when you're worried that someone might pull a gun on you if you don't get there first I guess.
Post by
Gone
Without meaning to push an agenda (I'm really not going there, just musing over the possible result of different approaches) I do wonder if the kind of aggression we see in so many US, police brutality videos stems from a natural reaction to police feeling that their lives are in danger all the time. In the UK armed police will be called on in specific circumstances where an armed response is required rather than the norm. But nobody is expected to be carrying guns during a normal day's law enforcement so there's no sense of bringing a truncheon to a gun-fight the rest of the time. Consequently, and you can certainly find
exceptions
to this, with use of guns requiring extra training and rigorous rules, armed police are wary of the power they're carrying.
The violent police videos and stories are certainly scary but I just wonder if there's an extent to which one can't blame these people for being scared and reacting by using extreme force. Actually "Can't blame" is wrong, we can and should, but an extent to which we can understand where it comes from. Things escalate quickly when you're worried that someone might pull a gun on you if you don't get there first I guess.
I think it more stems from the fact that police, in general, are treated like complete @#$% most of the time. Most people hate cops until they need one. My friends father and brother are both cops, and I've heard stories about them and officers they know having everything thrown at them from knives, to boiling water, to feces (yes really) when responding to domestic incidents (#$%^ing Springfield).
I also think that the 'bad cops' are usually a certain type of personality that is just attracted to power, and just joins because they lack self confidence and want to be able to exert power over others.
Post by
asakawa
I think it more stems from the fact that police, in general, are treated like complete @#$% most of the time. Most people hate cops until they need one. My friends father and brother are both cops, and I've heard stories about them and officers they know having everything thrown at them from knives, to boiling water, to feces (yes really) when responding to domestic incidents (#$%^ing Springfield).
If the problem is police reacting with extreme aggression in situations where that is unnecessary and inappropriate then that problem is only solved by police remaining calm and only using force if absolutely necessary/required. I sympathise for the sorts of things that police men and women have to handle on a day to day basis but that simply isn't an excuse for being presumptuous and physically bullying their way through every situation, regardless of the threat.
Some people (I think "most" is hyperbole) will always be suspicious and aggressive towards police officers, others become so due to bad experiences or stories. Bad PR is no excuse for bad behaviour.
Also, this current issue of police being filmed needs to be resolved. I guess we're just waiting for the right story (sadly, likely meaning something particularly tragic) to really hit mainstream news to make sure that everyone, including police officers, know their rights. Police almost certainly need more thorough training in laws/rights and more in-service training throughout their careers to keep up with developments. They should know the rights of citizens better than the citizens themselves and be there to defend them not breach them.
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
Just because
someone
something looks good on paper, doesn't mean they are. (Looking at you,
obama
democracy)
Fixed?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
It's not about how democracy looks, it's how democracy works. If you can legitimately elect someone, and if the army decides they don't like him, they have now shown that they can and will stage a coup. That's how democracy in Egypt works right now, and that
is
going to have far reaching consequences on democracy in Egypt and the rest of the Middle East.
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
The army staged a coup. That's a fact. The army, through force of its presence, declared that Morsi was no longer president and that the constitution was dissolved. And that's not a good sign for democracy's long-term stability in the area. I don't understand what exactly in that you're arguing against.
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